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To: Mad Dawg; Dr. Eckleburg; metmom; OLD REGGIE; RnMomof7
As amusing as your anecdotes are re calvinist pastors somewhere in the midwest, a clearer view of alcoholism, as with any addiction, be it drugs, or gambling or porn, is that it is a spiritual disease. None thus afflicted can enter the kingdom of heaven. And no amount of rehab ever cures it either--- these sufferers have an emptiness that they desperately seek--they have a big hole at the heart of them that only God can fill. And they can't "find God". God if it is his will, will find them.

Pastors can't save anybody, all they can do is preach the gospel.

Now as to the revered (in some circles) Theresa, the woman attained her reward here on earth, and that is what the bible teaches. She sought the acclaim of men and she received it. She mingled with all the great of the earth who ran after her, longing to touch her skirt. They adored (worshiped) her and she allowed it. I know of no instances where she insisted that Christ and Christ alone, led to mankind's salvation. She was a new age guru-- she said "Do what feels right to you". In that she is no differnt from the Dalai Lama, Deepak Chopra, or Oprah.

1,423 posted on 09/05/2010 1:07:55 PM PDT by 1000 silverlings (everything that deceives, also enchants: Plato)
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To: 1000 silverlings
As amusing as your anecdotes are re calvinist pastors somewhere in the midwest,
Actually, deep south. Columbus MS.

I don't see anything in what you say that addresses what the pastor said. Is it right to neglect alcoholics "because they are going to hell anyway?"

I would say addictions are diseases with a strong, maybe even a dominant 'spiritual' component. I have tried to keep up with the field, AND I have known people who, having started the never-ending recovery process, then received the Lord into their lives and hearts. I have also known people who first had a religious conversion and THEN quit drinking. Both groups seem to benefit (or at least those who love them do) from continued 'spiritual growth', consciously sought.

Is it your general thought that .... well, try this:
I was chaplain at a home for severely handicapped kids. Though it was fewer than ten miles from Charlottesville and had been there since Hector was a pup -- and longer, very few people knew about it. The board seemed more preoccupied with being First Families of Virginia than with keeping the place going. ( I got $50 a week for my alleged work.)

So I went to a local 'radio personality' and bought time on the Sunday morning schedule and for 4-5 years I had a show every Sunday without fail (though some were taped in advance.)

As a result of my attention seeking and publicity-grubbing, I raised local awareness of the institution, shamed the board ( a very little -- they were pretty proof against shame), and raised money on which I had to pay taxes but all of which went to the care of the children.

I mingled with the local 'great', and dealt with their misplaced admiration. There's a word for what I was that I cannot use on the Religion Forum. Let's say "attention prostitute." I'm hoping that's acceptable.

BUT I achieved the objective, by God's grace and the generosity of my audience of two or three. It took the help of the Federal Government to close the home.

So I suppose I also have received my reward. In any event I am edified by the respect given to the injunction not to judge, and the careful exercise of the responsibility to avoid taking quotes out of context when one is doing a hatchet job.

Time: What's your greatest hope here in India?

Mother Teresa: To give Jesus to all.

Time: But you do not evangelize in the conventional sense of the term.

Mother Teresa: I'm evangelizing by my works of love.

Time: Is that the best way?

Mother Teresa: For us, yes. For somebody else, something else. I'm evangelizing the way God wants me to. Jesus said go and preach to all the nations. We are now in so many nations preaching the Gospel by our works of love. "By the love that you have for one another will they know you are my disciples." That's the preaching that we are doing, and I think that is more real.

Time: Friends of yours say that you are disappointed that your work has not brought more conversions in this great Hindu nation.

Mother Teresa: Missionaries don't think of that. They only want to proclaim the Word of God. Numbers have nothing to do with it. But the people are putting prayer into action by coming and serving the people. Continually people are coming to feed and serve, so many, you go and see. Everywhere people are helping. We don't know the future. But the door is already open to Christ. There may not be a big conversion like that, but we don't know what is happening in the soul.

Time: What do you think of Hinduism?

Mother Teresa: I love all religions, but I am in love with my own. No discussion. That's what we have to prove to them. Seeing what I do, they realize that I am in love with Jesus.

Time: And they should love Jesus too?

Mother Teresa: Naturally, if they want peace, if they want joy, let them find Jesus. If people become better Hindus, better Moslems, better Buddhists by our acts of love, then there is something else growing there. They come closer and closer to God. When they come closer, they have to choose.

Here.

To me the way what she says has been taken out of context is morally and almost physically revolting.

1,493 posted on 09/05/2010 6:00:08 PM PDT by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
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