Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

To: Godzilla
As an Eagle Scout myself, I take exception to your belittling of the LDS Scouting program.

Thomas Monson, President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints has served on the BSA National Executive Board since 1969, and still does. Others include the Young Men general president, who serves on the National Executive Board; and Young Men general presidency and Primary general presidency, who serve as members of the National Advisory Board.

According to a report published by the Boy Scouts of America (December 31, 2009) titled “Top 30 Chartered Organizations Ranked by Youth,” The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints was ranked as number one in total units and number one in membership. The report also states that nationally about 17 percent of the BSA’s traditional membership is registered in units sponsored by the Church. The percentage is much higher in the western United States.

http://www.ldsbsa.org/pdf/resources/Booklet_Scouting%20in%20the%20Church%20Second%20Edition.pdf

You are free to degrade the good work the BSA and LDS community do together, but you will find no sympathy here! You may have an ax to grind, but you will find in me no stone to sharpen it on, so if you're looking for debate, sorry.

59 posted on 08/23/2010 9:17:57 AM PDT by Ripliancum ("As He died to make men holy, let us live to make men free")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 46 | View Replies ]


To: Ripliancum; Caipirabob
As an Eagle Scout myself, I take exception to your belittling of the LDS Scouting program.

Glad to hear you made eagle. However, facts are that in 1974 a black boy was denied the position of senior patrol leader solely because he was black. The ombudsman for the state said Mormon "troop policy is that in order for a scout to become a patrol leader, he must be a deacon's quorum president in the LDS Church. Since the boy cannot hold the priesthood, he cannot become a patrol leader." (July 18, 1974, the Salt Lake Tribune). In fact, further investigation at the time showed that all non-mormon boys were barred from lds sponsored troops as well ( (Dialogue, Autumn 1981, vol. 14, no. 3, p. 20).

The NAACP took the mormon church and BSA to court - but the mormon church quickly reversed its policy. All because the mormon church had effectively intergrated its troops with Aaronic Priesthood groups.

So before you toot the horn too loudly, lds troops have a history of racial discrimination. So the instance of racial discrimination described by Caipirabob is not out of the realm. I certainly hope it is an outlier Rip, but you can't deny the past.

66 posted on 08/23/2010 9:36:38 AM PDT by Godzilla ( 3-7-77)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 59 | View Replies ]

To: Ripliancum; Godzilla
First, congratulations on earning the Eagle Award.

To take issue with the "data" you posted."...was ranked as number one in total units and number one in membership..."

Registration numbers are statistics. Since each LdS ward will have a Cub Pack, a Blazer program (11 year old Scouts), a Boy Scout Troop, a Varsity Team and a Venture Crew that is 5 "units". They register every "member" of Scouting age living in the ward boundaries irrespective of whether they attend meetings or not. How do I know that? I worked the "unit" recharters for a couple of years and to get the Chartered Rep to "drop" boys from the registration due to inactivity, no church attendance, etc. was impossible. SLC directive he told me.

So, in other words, those statistics you refer to are meaningless. You want to challenge my assertions? Go right ahead. I was very involved in LdS Scouting for many years, both as an active and inactive member.

For that piece of PR you posted, the reality where I live is that the LdS run some of the most inept programs around. They have "good" numbers, but their programs are rudimentary at best. The culprit? Turnover. The turnover rate for leaders is tantamount to criminal because once a leader is trained (IF you can get the Scouting leaders to get trained) they're "released" from their callings within a very short time.

The average tenure for an LDS Scouter (leader) is 7-9 months (with no overlap for continuity) whereas tenure for a non-LDS Scouter (leader) is 5-12 years.

The few LdS Scouters that I admire and respect bemoan the "management" of Scouting within the LdS. Yet, they "submit" to their ward leadership with little chance of success lest they be labeled as a troublemaker. What we have seen is that SLC gives a lot of lip service about how important training is and how important the program is, yet, the reality is a heck of alot different than what SLC is saying. Why are wards disobeying SLC?

LdS Scouts are eyed with a certain amount of skepticism when going to their Eagle BoR. Why? Ever hear of the term "basketball Eagle"? Is it unfortunate? You betcha! And whose fault is it? Who pays the price for an ineffectual program and leadership?

You may or may not be aware of a pretty grim, yet important statistic; in the BSA, the Lds have approximately 17% of the boys registered nationally, yet, ~ 50% of the fatalities arising from activity-related accidents were in LDS sponsored units. You can search google and read the stories, most are a result of ineffectual leadership.

What matters most is how the program is operated. In my experience, it's poorly.

88 posted on 08/23/2010 11:53:02 AM PDT by SZonian (July 27, 2010. Life begins anew.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 59 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson