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To: roamer_1
They know better than to define Him on their own terms, and consider it to be a great blasphemy.

That's more or less the point of Maimonides and the students of Kabbalah when they posit that God can only be described by negation. That is, He is so different than what we know that we cannot say what He is, only what He isn't. For example, if I say, "God is love," a true statement according to Scripture, I unfortunately limit Him to my own concept of love, which is like comparing a candle to the sun.

That's not to say that the Eternal One is completely unknowable (I think Kabbalah sometimes goes too far in that respect, resulting in treating Ein Sof as a force rather than a Being), but that we have to be very careful in always acknowledging that all of our models will be flawed and fall short of the glory of God.

Nevertheless, you might be interested in the model I present in post #1358, which draws from both sides of my heritage. It is far from a perfect model, but it does help in explaining Yeshua's claim to be "from" the Father.

Shalom.

1,361 posted on 07/08/2010 2:29:37 PM PDT by Buggman (returnofbenjamin.wordpress.com - Baruch haBa b'Shem ADONAI!)
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To: Buggman
we cannot say what He is, only what He isn't

I think it's best if we recognize that God knows who HE is - I AM that I AM.

And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.
1,370 posted on 07/08/2010 2:48:47 PM PDT by presently no screen name
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To: Buggman
For example, if I say, "God is love," a true statement according to Scripture, I unfortunately limit Him to my own concept of love, which is like comparing a candle to the sun.

I think that's pretty true.

That's not to say that the Eternal One is completely unknowable (I think Kabbalah sometimes goes too far in that respect, resulting in treating Ein Sof as a force rather than a Being), but that we have to be very careful in always acknowledging that all of our models will be flawed and fall short of the glory of God.

Also quite true, IMHO. I am not concerned with modeling or comparison. I think that is a natural form of outreach, an attempt at understanding.

It is when those models become DOGMA, and exclusionary... particularly when "ordained" without specific proofs... That is when it becomes unhealthy. The truth of the matter is simply put: WE DON'T KNOW.

God has provided us with the model that He prefers, primarily that of a Father, His Son, and the Holy Spirit. He did so for a purpose, and He obviously believes that what He has revealed is sufficient in parameter(s) to know Him. Now, I don't pretend to know how that works, because He didn't tell me. I am just thankful that He gave me a means to approach Him. I prefer to operate within that which He has provided. That is, I believe, worshiping in spirit and in truth - His primary instruction.

So it seems, if we stay within His provision, if we pray to the Father in the name of the Son (as priest), by the means of the Holy Spirit, you and I can kneel together before Him as brethren. That, friend, is not a false ecumenism.

I would note that my position is most similar to the Trinitarian model - But I will not deny a brother whose belief is in an hierarchical Godhead, as an instance. I have no legitimate proof to the contrary. We might have long arguments over the subject, but neither of us KNOWS.

Nevertheless, you might be interested in the model I present in post #1358, which draws from both sides of my heritage. It is far from a perfect model, but it does help in explaining Yeshua's claim to be "from" the Father.

An excellent analogy. And I note that it was framed as such: An analogy. : )

Shalom to you too.

1,486 posted on 07/08/2010 10:03:52 PM PDT by roamer_1 (Globalism is just Socialism in a business suit)
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