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To: annalex; Dr. Eckleburg; blue-duncan; xzins; betty boop; TXnMA; MHGinTN; GOPJ; shibumi
Thank you for sharing your insights, dear brother in Christ!

Again I'd like to underscore the observer problem associated with man trying to understand time.

We mortals persistently sense time as a line, an arrow of time, as events move from past>present>future. In reality, we never sense anything in the present due to the time lag between sensation and cognition.

God has no such limitation.

And geometric physics strongly suggests there may be more than one dimension of time. What we think is a line may be a plane or volume, what we call past, present and future existing concurrently as a moment.

But even that observation refers to the space/time continuum, part of the Creation. And God the Creator is not limited by His own creation.

Even the word "eternal" is inadequate when we meditate on God because eternal only means time without limitation. It binds us to an arrow of time in our meditations.

So I strongly suggest the word "timeless" when meditating on God the Creator in contrast to His Creation, a property of which is space/time, i.e. geometry.

If one meditates with the term "timeless" it becomes obvious that when God says a thing, it is. Indeed, it is because He said it.

And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. - Genesis 1:3

By the word of the LORD were the heavens made; and all the host of them by the breath of his mouth. - Psalms 33:6

And that illuminates the Name of God, Word.

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. In him was life; and the life was the light of men. – John 1:1-4

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. - John 14:6

And that the words of God are spirit and life.

For the word of God [is] quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and [is] a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. - Hebrews 4:12

It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, [they] are spirit, and [they] are life. - John 6:63

To him the porter openeth; and the sheep hear his voice: and he calleth his own sheep by name, and leadeth them out. And when he putteth forth his own sheep, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice. And a stranger will they not follow, but will flee from him: for they know not the voice of strangers. – John 10:3-5

Meditating with the word "timeless" also illuminates the Truth that God cannot lie, nor could Adam be let off the hook or Jesus spared the crucifixion.

In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began; - Titus 1:2

But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die [literally, muwth muwth or “death death”]. – Genesis 2:17

And he went a little further, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou [wilt]. - Matt 26:39

Finally, meditating with the word "timeless" instead of an arrow of time illuminates these passages and lays aside the property of cause>effect which we also so often wrongfully apply to God the Creator of causation itself.

And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. – Revelation 13:8

According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved. – Ephesians 1:4-6

To God be the glory, not man, never man.

1,036 posted on 07/16/2010 8:27:30 AM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: Alamo-Girl

EXCELLENT.

WELL PUT.

THX THX.

PRAISE GOD.

PRAYERS AND HUGS FOR YOUR NIECE ETC.


1,041 posted on 07/16/2010 8:47:53 AM PDT by Quix (THE PLAN of the Bosses: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2519352/posts?page=2#2)
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To: Alamo-Girl
"But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die [literally, muwth muwth or “death death”]. – Genesis 2:17"
I believe Jesus gave us clues that this death-death is the death in/of the spirit, as in created spirit void of LIFE in it. When Jesus told his followers to 'let the dead go bury the dead', I believe He gave us a powerful clue that there are at least two forms of the state of dead, and that one refers to the spirit without God-Life therein.

I also believe that Jesus shows up in the Old Testament, in several places. But that is grist for another mill ...

1,056 posted on 07/16/2010 10:49:21 AM PDT by MHGinTN (Obots, believing they cannot be deceived, it is impossible to convince them when they are deceived.)
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To: Alamo-Girl; Dr. Eckleburg; blue-duncan; xzins; betty boop; TXnMA; MHGinTN; GOPJ; shibumi
As soon as I hit Send on one of my posts to you I realized that I said "eternal" when I meant to say "extratemporal". Good point.

Regarding multidimensional time, we can wax mathematical and develop such concepts, but as far as human experience goes, we are creatures in time and unidimensional time at that. If we want to describe God using a multidimensional time analogy, we can. It will be one metaphore among many that we use. When the Bible has God walking in the cool of the evening going "Adam, Adam, where art thou?" that is helpful metaphore as well.

The ontological fact remains that God is outside of time in principle, regardless of what exactly, is time. He is outside of it if it is single dimension, and He is outside of it if it is 12-dimensional, or 1.41-dimensional. He is outside of it because He created it, such as it is.

Regarding human existence, as well, we know that we exist in eternity. Are we destined for life outside of time? The scripture does not say, but St. Thomas Aquinas speculated that at the Second Coming the movement of the stars and planets will stop, which is to say, time will stop also. (Question 91. The quality of the world after the judgment, see item 2)

1,066 posted on 07/16/2010 6:07:07 PM PDT by annalex (http://www.catecheticsonline.com/CatenaAurea.php)
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