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To: RnMomof7
The judgment of works is a judgment of rewards..

No, according to Mt. 25 it is not. It is given both sheep and goats symmetrically basedon their works.

If one is trying to work their way into heaven than their "works " are not done for the glory of God..but for the salvation of themselves

.. which is not a bad motivation at all. It is not perfect, but it still leads to individual salvation.

the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works

Yes, blessed is he. But it doesn't say that good works are not required for salvation generally. Obviou they are nto required, for example, for babies who die, or to people God chose to forgive seing their repentance, like King David.

Catholic theology makes God mans debtor

God gave us His son. He did not have to. Our works obligate God only in the sense that God already told us how He will judge us. Had he not told us, we would not be expecting salvation; since He has, we do.

The goats were always goats.. the sheep were always sheep

No; the passage in Matthew 25 does not say that and there are many examples of goats converting and sheep losign salvation in the gospel. At any rate, your remark does not alter that fact that the judgment is by the works according to Mt. 25.

They were not seeking Christ or His approval or His reward for their work.. They were just being sheep

They were just doing good works in His grace, not even knowing it. That part proves that works are salvific even in the absence of conscious faith.

864 posted on 06/21/2010 5:58:57 AM PDT by annalex
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To: annalex; Dr. Eckleburg; Iscool; boatbums; Quix
Scripture always confirms scripture

Mat 16:27"For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father, with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works."

Luke 14:14"For thou shalt be recompensed at the resurrection of the just."

(Rev 22:12)"And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be."

1Peter 5:4 And when the chief Shepherd shall appear, ye shall receive a crown of glory that fadeth not away."

The Goats are condemned , not because they did not work, but because that work was not done to the glory of God.. They did the works of the natural man..... they had never repented and believed..and scripture tells us that what is not of Faith IS SIN, so this was a sin judgement for the goats and a reward judgement for the sheep

The God pleasing works were not self serving works to earn or secure their salvation or for the approval of men ..They flowed out of the heart of Christ as works HE HAD ORDAINED for them before the foundation of the world

Romans 4:5  But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

They were not sheep because they did the work that God had ordained for them, they did the work because they were the sheep.

Gal. 2:16: "[T]hat we may be justified by faith in Christ, and not by the works of the Law; since by the works of the Law shall no flesh be justified

Hear Jesus teaching on salvation by works

but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.

The goats brought forth fruit..but it was not God pleasing work..

Mat 7:18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither [can] a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.

The goats could never do works pleasing to God no matter what they did

Mat 7:19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.

A judgement of works..... but that judgemen actually happened before the works, because they were not good "trees" to begin with (sheep)

Mat 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

So the works do not make one good..but they tell us the condition of the the relationship with God

Mat 7:21

Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Christ NEVER knew them, they were never saved then lost.. HE NEVER knew them . They pleaded their case on works.. BUT their fruit was rotten to the core, because its roots were not in Christ

893 posted on 06/21/2010 10:17:32 AM PDT by RnMomof7
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To: annalex
They were just doing good works in His grace, not even knowing it. That part proves that works are salvific even in the absence of conscious faith.

This is Christianity, from the beginning. The trouble with the Johnny come latelies, the armchair quarterbacks, and the seekers of personal power, is that their message is quantifiably different from the Church, from the Apostles, and most importantly, from Jesus/

980 posted on 06/21/2010 7:01:51 PM PDT by MarkBsnr ( I would not believe in the Gospel if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so.)
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