Posted on 06/13/2010 12:16:24 PM PDT by markomalley
.- Thousands of pilgrims and faithful gathered at noon Sunday in St. Peter’s Square to pray the Angelus with the Holy Father. Before the prayer, he said that the fruits of the recently ended Year for Priests could never be measured, but are already visible and will continue to be ever more so.
“The priest is a gift from the heart of Christ, a gift for the Church and for the world. From the heart of the Son of God, overflowing with love, all the goods of the Church spring forth,” proclaimed Pope Benedict XVI. “One of those goods is the vocations of those men who, conquered by the Lord Jesus, leave everything behind to dedicate themselves completely to the Christian community, following the example of the Good Shepherd.”
The Holy Father described the priest as having been formed by “the same charity of Christ, that love which compelled him to give his life for his friends and to forgive his enemies.”
“Therefore,” he continued, “priests are the primary builders of the civilization of love.”
Benedict XVI exhorted priests to always seek the intercession of St. John Marie Vianney, whose prayer, the “Act of Love,” was prayed frequently during the Year for Priests, and “continues to fuel our dialogue with God.”
The pontiff also spoke about the close of the Year for Priests, which took place this past week and culminated with the Solemnity of the Sacred Heart of Jesus. He emphasized “the unforgettable days in the presence of more than 15,000 priests from around the world.”
The feast of the Sacred Heart is traditionally a “day of priestly holiness,” but this time it was especially so, Benedict XVI remarked.
Pope Benedict concluded his comments by noting that, in contemplating history, “one observes so many pages of authentic social and spiritual renewal which have been written by the decisive contribution of Catholic priests.” These were inspired “only by their passion for the Gospel and for mankind, for his true civil and religious freedom.”
“So many initiatives that promote the entire human being have begun with the intuition of a priestly heart,” he exclaimed.
The Pope then prayed the Angelus, greeted those present in various languages, and imparted his apostolic blessing.
Strictly and grammatically speaking, Ehp. 2:8 says that grace is a gift of God, not faith. However, indeed both faith and good works come from God, to Whom alone is the glory. Thank you for stating the Catholic teaching for us. Abandon the mendacious shipwreck of Protestantism and come to Christ and His glorious Church, and you shall see the light.
It is, and indeed my question is rhetorical. The priesthood does exist in the scripture and I showed you where. Now, you do not answer the similar question about the two cardinal errors of Protestantism on this thread, but I was hoping to demonstrate that you simply cannot. I received dosens of replies to my simple rhetorical question; most were evasive and none satisfying.
You may find a "Catholic" source for anything. St. Paul considered it sacrifice (1 Cor. 11:26-29).
you assume because of your TRADITION that only the apostles could pass on the right to preside over the Lords supper.. but that is never stated anywhere in scripture
Because Christ gave that right to the Apostles alone, at the Last Supper, and the scripture records that.
He destroyed the Levitical priesthood, but not the priesthood of Christ and His Church.
this, for that he continueth for ever, hath an everlasting priesthood (Heb 7:24)
Catholic priesthood is forever in the order of Melchizedek. It is an unfortuinate coincidence of the English language that the word is the same.
That the faith and the Holy Scripture are really important and are in fact goft of God to us is Catholic doctrine. Thanks for the supporting quotes.
So are you saying that you don’t believe in the priest acting in place of Christ during the Mass??
Alter Christus??
Please do some checking on that.
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Can you give me a scripture on that? I thought that Jesus Christ is the only priest of the new covenant.
But not only of speaking. The Last supper also consisted of the declaration that the bread is His Body, sacrificed for us, and concluded with the commandment "do this".
You can even imagine that Catholics and Lutherans are close [doctrinally]
No, I would never consider Lutherans as a whole close. East and West are a poor analogy though because the Orthodox and the Catholics are an example of nearly identical doctrine, which by the way is another way yto show that the so-called Reformation had nothing to do with the defects in the Western Church and everything to do with attempted apostacy by the Protestants.
There you go. Salvation comes solely from grace. Faith and good works deliver the salvation, but not faith alone.
I just don't understand why you don't get it...Except that maybe you just want to reject easy, clear scripture to bolster your cause...
And of course you must change a word here and there to twist the meaning...
Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.
Not with works lest any man should boast, for we are His workmanship...
We don't do the work...He did the work in us...
Jesus created us Christians in Him, UNTO, NOT IN, but UNTO good works...
Contrary to your attempt to pervert the clear scriptures, we were NOT created in good works...We were created, as Christians, after Salvation, unto (to do) good works...
You may dazzle other Catholics with your fakery but you'll never get any where with Bible Believing Christians...We WILL defend God on the attacks against His written words...
The Catohlic Church never subscribed to the foolish idea that grace must or even can, be earned.
But it is still works. It is good works as opposed to pharisaic works done out of obligation. Heart of the Gospel. Thank you very much for reading this holy Catholic book.
Triple amen. Thank you for so clearly stating that Catholic doctrine, doctor.
annalex wrote:
“Strictly and grammatically speaking, Ehp. 2:8 says that grace is a gift of God, not faith.”
Does it not bother you to speak in direct, let me repeat that, direct contradiction of the Holy Scriptures? The Greek of Ephesians 2 is incontestably clear. Grace (charis) is feminine. Faith (pistos) is neuter. The demonstrative pronoun “that,” is a neuter, singular, referring to the antecedent neuter singular in the preceding phrase, the only one of which is “pistos,” faith. Again, annalex, you have asserted the precise opposite of the truth.
Does it not bother you to do this? Let us even stipulate that you did so out of ignorance. Does it not bother to assert so unequivocally in public what you really don’t know? Is your fierce anger toward the - and I quote you - “mendacious wreck of Protestantism” so great that simple facts are not to be allowed to get in the way of your argument?
Do you know what mendacious means?
James is in the Dispensation of the Millenial Kingdom. It starts in Hebrews (to the 12 tribes scattered abroad) and ends in Revelation when Christ the Messiah returns to set up His Kingdom.
We are in the Dispensation of the Grace of God. That is found in Romans through Philemon. When the Church the Body of Christ is complete, it will be caught up in the air to meet Christ (1 Thessalonians 4:16). There is a definite beginning and a definite ending to the Dispensation of Grace. If you are looking for your calling, your inheritence, your salvation, your sanctification, your sealing, and your security it will be found in Paul's Epistles.
If your "proof" is so darned irrefutable where is are the dozens and countless sources of corroboration you boasted of? I posted a half a dozen that contradicted your interpretation of the Pew study, but alas I can't make you read or understand them either. Your dismal performance in that instance only reinforces the conclusion many have come to regarding your credibility and voracity.
So I am to blame for your failed attempt to mind read?????? I do recognize why you would want to continue to discuss me and not attempt to actually answer the questions. Since I already know the answers your silence only impugns you and deprives me of nothing.
annalex wrote:
“But not only of speaking. The Last supper also consisted of the declaration that the bread is His Body, sacrificed for us, and concluded with the commandment ‘do this’.”
So, if I understand your “logic” correctly, Jesus’ command “do this,” means that in the phrase “this is My body which is given for you,” we are supposed to sacrifice His body? Of course the word sacrifice nowhere appears here. The word “given” (didomenon, a neuter singular - you have trouble with those neuter singulars, don’t you? - passive participle) is in reference to what Jesus was then and there doing, i.e., giving His body to them. That is the plain natural sense of the sentence. You want to take what Jesus DID the next day, Good Friday, and say that in the night in which He was betrayed He commanded them to do what He would do the following day, rather than doing what He was doing before their very eyes in real time in that upper room.
Again, sorry, annalex. Your grammar is bad. Your syntax is bad. Your exegesis is faulty. You are putting words in Jesus’ mouth that simply didn’t come out of His mouth.
As far as your “East and West” interpretation of what I meant by saying that on the matter of who did what in the Lord’s Supper and whether it is pure gift to us, as we would say, or something we are supposed to do in terms of offering intercessory sacrifice, as you would have us believe, I simply said that on this issue we, Catholic and Lutheran, were as far apart as east and west. My reference was to Psalm 103:12, and the obvious intent of the psalmist to say that the two are irreconcilable. You turned it into some kind of reference to Orthodox versus Catholic, about which I neither said or implied anything in the whole of the post to which you were responding. That was a leap on your part. Maybe, just maybe, you can see from that little incident that you have a tendency to leap first, without foundation or context. I merely point this out.
Scripture does not state that Jesus preached the Beatitudes only once and only to believers. We know for certain of at least one other instance known as the Sermon on the Plain (Luke 6:17-49) in which it describes those who came to hear him as "A large crowd of his disciples and:" a great number of people from all over Judea, from Jerusalem, and from the coast of Tyre and Sidon, who had come to hear him and to be healed of their diseases.
Except when that believer accepts or agrees with the interpretation Catholic Church?
Can you give me scriptural support for a command that the Christian faith must be based exclusively on a book and on what biblical basis do Protestants think that everything that Jesus and the apostles taught is captured in the New Testament writings?
I very strongly agree that those two chapters of Revelation give us a preview of worship in heaven and rejoice in your emphasis of Christ standing between the throne and the creatures.
Praise God!
Truly we are both discerning a revelation of Who God IS.
And I appreciate your bringing to the table the temporal aspects of the following verses, generally that man’s sense of time passing does not apply to God:
And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. – Revelation 13:8
But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day [is] with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. – 2 Peter 3:8
But instead, I’d like to point out two interesting observations concerning the one day/thousand years verse, 2 Peter 3:8.
The first is an insight from Jewish mystics that the following verses affirm that truth (emphasis mine:)
And all the days that Adam lived were nine hundred and thirty years: and he died. – Genesis 5:5
The Epistle of Barnabas dates back to the first few centuries after Christ’s resurrection. It is quoted by Clement of Alexandria and also mentioned by Origen. It was part of the Codex Sinaiticus but is not part of the Catholic canon today. Nevertheless, it reveals the discernment of these early Christians.
But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This [is] the first resurrection. Blessed and holy [is] he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years. – Revelation 20:4-6
But I say unto you, That in this place is [one] greater than the temple. But if ye had known what [this] meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice, ye would not have condemned the guiltless. For the Son of man is Lord even of the sabbath day. – Matt 12:5-8
Using the Christian calendar, Christ is due any time now (6,000 years have elapsed since Adam's first day on earth time.) Under the Jewish calendar, about a quarter century remains on the first 6,000 years. The difference is a dispute over how much time Israel spent in exile to Babylon.
To God be the glory, not man, never man.
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