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To: Judith Anne; Alamo-Girl; Mad Dawg
To me, Paul’s writing is so confused that I cannot really tell where he may or may not conflict with Church teaching. The first quote from your post above is a perfect example.

I think I will concur with Alamo Girl with the citation from St. Peter:

2 Pet 3:14 Wherefore, dearly beloved, waiting for these things, be diligent that you may be found before him unspotted and blameless in peace. 15 And account the longsuffering of our Lord, salvation: as also our most dear brother Paul, according to the wisdom given him, has written to you: 16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are certain things hard to be understood, which the unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, to their own destruction. 17 You therefore, brethren, knowing these things before, take heed, lest being led aside by the error of the unwise, you fall from your own steadfastness. 18 But grow in grace and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and unto the day of eternity, Amen.

Alamo Girl's advice about getting a cup of tea and sitting in an overstuffed chair and going through them slowly, along with re-reading the Gospel of John is very sage advice, as well.

You are quite right, though, Judith Anne, that many of St. Paul's writings are confusing to the point of frustration. Many of them bear long meditation rather than quick reading, as they are trying to synthesize the meanings of many complex Old Testament concepts and cast them in the proper light of the Advent of Christ. That is no easy job. One of the key examples, for me, was presented in Romans 7.

But here's the key point: just because our understanding of something is convoluted doesn't make the object of our understanding invalid...it simply means we need to work to comprehend better (yes, there is the off chance that there was a faulty transcription or translation that we are dealing with, such as the famous "Johannine Comma," but those are by far the exception to the rule)

As a guidepost, we always must remember that our Faith is that which was given by Christ to the apostles and passed on to this day. As such, the foremost consideration and the source, par excellence, is the Word of God. Therefore, Sacred Scripture...the written record of those apostolic teachings...can simply not be in error.

We are fortunate, as Catholics, to have available for us the Magesterium of the Church, which has preserved those apostolic teachings and provided the appropriate application throughout the centuries. In light of that, you might wish to take some of the confusing portions and research what has been written about them in a reference such as Biblia Clerus. Alternatively, the Navarre Bible is quite good, as well.

Having said that, I will likewise concur with the very learned Mad Dawg in that I, too, am quite attached to the Pauline Letters.

535 posted on 04/22/2010 10:43:02 AM PDT by markomalley (Extra Ecclesiam nulla salus)
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To: markomalley

“I’m quite attached to the Pauline letters’

And so am I.

I do think we might take into account that he was writing to various communities of believers, and could very easily have been adapting his style and content to the particular commmunity he was addressing.

It wouldn’t surprise me to hear someone say that this is one possible explanation for the way his letters are perceived/received.


573 posted on 04/22/2010 1:14:54 PM PDT by Running On Empty ((The three sorriest words: "It's too late"))
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To: markomalley; Judith Anne
You are quite right, though, Judith Anne, that many of St. Paul's writings are confusing to the point of frustration. Many of them bear long meditation rather than quick reading, as they are trying to synthesize the meanings of many complex Old Testament concepts and cast them in the proper light of the Advent of Christ. That is no easy job. One of the key examples, for me, was presented in Romans 7.

Paul's letters as bishop to his flock were chosen by the Church as Scripture, the same as James and Peter. We cannot throw them out - if you read the Catechism, much of the proofs come from Paul (although not, as with the Reformed Confessions, from Paul and the OT to the almost total exclusion of the Gospels).

621 posted on 04/22/2010 4:29:13 PM PDT by MarkBsnr ( I would not believe in the Gospel if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so.)
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To: markomalley
Thank you oh so very much for sharing your testimony, dear brother in Christ, and your insights! And thank you for your encouragements!
713 posted on 04/22/2010 8:34:14 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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