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To: boatbums
Nicea may take credit for defining and using the word “trinity” but that concept - because it has ALWAYS been the nature of the only, true God - exists in both the Old and New Testaments of the Bible. YOPIOS notwithstanding!

Now we hit on the problem - the understanding of God by human beings. The OT does not have any sort of personages of God - the Jews never conceived of their Messiah as their deity. It was God - Yahweh, Jehovah - but as a single entity with a single perception by men.

The NT times introduced Jesus as Messiah, and Son of God in a subordinationalist fashion. Nicea confirmed the Trinity to men. I agree that God is God and God is I AM. The problem is the perception of men.

1,241 posted on 04/24/2010 5:48:49 PM PDT by MarkBsnr ( I would not believe in the Gospel if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so.)
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To: MarkBsnr
The OT does not have any sort of personages of God - the Jews never conceived of their Messiah as their deity.

I don't see how you can say that in light of the very first book of Moses - Genesis 1:26 - where the Lord says, "Let us make man in our image, after our likeness:". The very name used for God, even, was Elohem, and was a PLURAL noun! Why didn't Moses use the singular form (Elohah or El) if God was a singular being? Plural, by the way in the usage, meant three or more.

1,261 posted on 04/24/2010 6:29:06 PM PDT by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to him.)
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To: MarkBsnr; boatbums

MB: “The OT does not have any sort of personages of God - the Jews never conceived of their Messiah as their deity. It was God - Yahweh, Jehovah - but as a single entity with a single perception by men.”

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On the contrary....

Psalm 2

1 Why do the nations conspire
and the peoples plot in vain?

2 The kings of the earth take their stand
and the rulers gather together
against the LORD
and against his Anointed One.

3 “Let us break their chains,” they say,
“and throw off their fetters.”

4 The One enthroned in heaven laughs;
the Lord scoffs at them.

5 Then he rebukes them in his anger
and terrifies them in his wrath, saying,

6 “I have installed my King
on Zion, my holy hill.”

7 I will proclaim the decree of the LORD :
He said to me, “You are my Son ;
today I have become your Father.

8 Ask of me,
and I will make the nations your inheritance,
the ends of the earth your possession.

9 You will rule them with an iron scepter ;
you will dash them to pieces like pottery.”

10 Therefore, you kings, be wise;
be warned, you rulers of the earth.

11 Serve the LORD with fear
and rejoice with trembling.

12 Kiss the Son, lest he be angry
and you be destroyed in your way,
for his wrath can flare up in a moment.
Blessed are all who take refuge in him.


1,263 posted on 04/24/2010 6:36:17 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: MarkBsnr; boatbums

MB: “The OT does not have any sort of personages of God - the Jews never conceived of their Messiah as their deity. It was God - Yahweh, Jehovah - but as a single entity with a single perception by men.”

**********************************************************************

And this.....
26In the sixth month the angel Gabriel was sent from God to a city of Galilee named Nazareth, 27 to a virgin betrothed to a man whose name was Joseph, of the house of David. And the virgin’s name was Mary. 28And he came to her and said, “Greetings, O favored one, the Lord is with you!” 29But she was greatly troubled at the saying, and tried to discern what sort of greeting this might be. 30And the angel said to her, “Do not be afraid, Mary, for you have found favor with God. 31And behold, you will conceive in your womb and bear a son, and you shall call his name Jesus. 32He will be great and will be called the Son of the Most High. And the Lord God will give to him the throne of his father David, 33and he will reign over the house of Jacob forever, and of his kingdom there will be no end.”

34And Mary said to the angel, “How will this be, since I am a virgin?”

35And the angel answered her, “The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; therefore the child to be born will be called holy— the Son of God. 36And behold, your relative Elizabeth in her old age has also conceived a son, and this is the sixth month with her who was called barren. 37For nothing will be impossible with God.” 38And Mary said, “Behold, I am the servant of the Lord; let it be to me according to your word.” And the angel departed from her.

39In those days Mary arose and went with haste into the hill country, to a town in Judah, 40and she entered the house of Zechariah and greeted Elizabeth. 41And when Elizabeth heard the greeting of Mary, the baby leaped in her womb. And Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit, 42and she exclaimed with a loud cry, “Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb! 43And why is this granted to me that the mother of my Lord should come to me? 44For behold, when the sound of your greeting came to my ears, the baby in my womb leaped for joy. 45And blessed is she who believed that there would be a fulfillment of what was spoken to her from the Lord.”


1,264 posted on 04/24/2010 6:39:33 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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