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To: blue-duncan
What is your definition of belief and faith? You seem to say they are not “work” and yet all of the definitions I can find say they require knowledge and reasoning.

The Biblical concept of faith seems to connote the notion of three components: notitia (understanding the content of the Christian faith), fiducia (trust), and assensus (the assent of the intellect to the truth of a Biblical proposition). It seems to involve the compatibility that faith and reason are nonhostile to each other. They, in fact, work together to a condition of placing trust in the knowledge and understanding. Belief in rests on belief that. Biblically, faith is not a blind, irrational leap into the dark. Faith and reason cooperate on a Biblical view of faith.

Belief, as differentiated from knowledge, in that one may have a belief, completely divested from reality, while knowledge is a warranted true belief. This is exhaustively discussed by Alvin Plantinga in his discussion of warranted true belief in its true, properly functioning (as it ought) in the proper environment for which it was designed.

It is true, that in a Christian worldview, the reality of God's statement, 'faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the Word,' is understandable only in the Christian worldview. The atheist will not assent to the truth of God and therefore makes argument ineffectual when engaging the atheist.

But to your specific reference of 'work', it does seem that to preach the gospel to a 6 month old will not result in a warranted knowledge, nor assent to belief in some concept which they do not understand. If, however one preaches that same gospel to a 30 year old and that persons, 'hears' the Word, understands that Word, assents to that understanding, and claims faith in that more sure Promise of the Word, they are Christian (orthodox, Christian). Are those 'acts', works?

677 posted on 03/06/2010 9:13:24 PM PST by Texas Songwriter
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To: Texas Songwriter

If, however one preaches that same gospel to a 30 year old and that persons, ‘hears’ the Word, understands that Word, assents to that understanding, and claims faith in that more sure Promise of the Word, they are Christian (orthodox, Christian). Are those ‘acts’, works?

The ability to “hear” the word is given by God. The unbeliever cannot hear the word, (1Cr 2:14) “But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know [them], because they are spiritually discerned”. Jesus says in Matt. 13:14, “So they make Isaiah’s prophecy (Isa. 6:9) come true: ‘You will hear clearly but never understand. You will see clearly but never comprehend.” The unbeliever is not able on his own to come to a saving knowledge so how can he exercise the “faith” that accesses salvation. 2Ti 3:7, “Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.” Faith is part and parcel of the gracious gift of salvation. It is a works salvation to say that the unbeliever of his own “free will” can exercise unregenerate faith to access salvation.


696 posted on 03/07/2010 4:43:41 PM PST by blue-duncan
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