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To: Dr. Eckleburg; blue-duncan; P-Marlowe
About "deliberating", I refer you to Blue-Duncan's 6736

Ephesians 1:11 is perhaps the clearest expression of the concept of the sovereignty of God, though there are other verses that teach the sovereignty of God (Ps 115:3; Prov 16:9, 33; Dan 4:34-35). In verse 11 Paul continues the theme of God’s predestining us in Christ for salvation. Paul says that such a marking off of the believer beforehand was done “according to the purpose of him who accomplishes all things according to the counsel of his will.” The clause beginning with “who” is a relative clause modifying him. According to this verse, believers are predestined to salvation in accord with the purpose of God, and God does all things, including predestining to salvation, according to the counsel of his will. The clause, then, broadens the scope of the verse to speak of God’s sovereign control not only over election to salvation, but over all else.

As to the phrase according to the counsel of his will, the distinction between “counsel” and “will” is that the former involves purpose and deliberation while the latter simply denotes willing. The basic thrust of the phrase is that God chooses after deliberating on the wisest course of action to accomplish his purpose. Thus, this verse refers to a plan resulting from deliberation. This verse, then, indicates that what occurs is foreordained by God, and nothing external to God such as the foreseen actions or merits of God’s creatures determines his choices. God deliberates, chooses and accomplishes all things on the basis of his purposes. How does God accomplish all things? Some are done directly and exclusively by God without use of other agents, but most are accomplished through the agency of others (humans, angels, donkeys, etc.).

Clearly, this verse teaches the absolute sovereignty of God. Just as clearly, with such a notion of sovereignty, there is no room for indeterministic freedom. Given indeterministic freedom, God cannot guarantee that what he decides will be carried out. No matter how much God inclines someone’s will toward what he has chosen, such inclination, on an indeterministic account of freedom, can never be sufficient to produce God’s decreed action. Given indeterminism, there is no way for God to be in control of the world as outlined in Ephesians 1:11


7,001 posted on 01/29/2010 5:26:38 AM PST by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! Those who support our troops pray for their victory!)
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To: xzins; Dr. Eckleburg; blue-duncan; P-Marlowe

Excellent point xzins and BD. I think sometimes we take the Omniscience of God too far and assume that because God is Omniscient that he does not need to put any thought into his actions, that somehow merely by speaking the universe into existence it did not require that God actually DESIGN it or put any thought into it.

God claims it took him six days to create the heavens and the earth. Why so long?


7,005 posted on 01/29/2010 6:05:47 AM PST by P-Marlowe (LPFOKETT GAHCOEEP-w/o*)
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