Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

To: annalex

“If sola scriptura teaches against veneration of saints and baptism of babies, then the principle that things such as veneration of saints and baptism of babies, and also sola scriptura itself should be not merely compatible with the Bible, they should be spelled out with the Bible.”

Sola scriptura does not, in itself, say that NOTHING can be outside scripture, just that nothing essential to salvation and holy living - for scripture can make you wise to salvation thru faith in Jesus, and when used to teach, rebuke, etc it fully prepares one for every good work.

Veneration of the saints may or may not be in scripture - define veneration. WORSHIP is not, but I agree with the Catholics on this board who reject the idea they worship saints. As I pointed out a while back, I sort of felt like bowing at a John Wayne costume - and have saluted fallen comrades, my Dad’s grave, and felt very reverential in the Air & Space Museum in DC. I guess a lifetime in military aviation can have that effect.

Hebrews lists the many who have gone before us as examples and encouragement to us - and I find great encouragement from contemplating the life of William Tyndale. So I’m on your side on that argument.

Infant baptism - never explicitly taught, and no known examples in scripture. Meanwhile, baptism is taught as following belief, not preceding it. Sola scriptura might not totally reject infant baptism, but it certainly makes it highly debatable. Those churches that practice it regardless need to ask themselves why they do something without scriptural authority. Baptists do not practice it.

Confession - done in private? Well, how about just confessing to God? We see no priests in the NT, nor any instruction or example of church officers taking confession. Confession to each other IS allowed, and in at least one case encouraged. Arguing from silence, confession should be to God. If one wants to confess to another, that is your business. But there are no priests, and no penance. So adding those goes beyond the faith delivered to us once for all.


4,735 posted on 01/18/2010 8:07:51 PM PST by Mr Rogers (I loathe the ground he slithers on!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4730 | View Replies ]


To: Mr Rogers
Veneration of the saints may or may not be in scripture - define veneration. WORSHIP is not, but I agree with the Catholics on this board who reject the idea they worship saints

Ah, very well. So according to you, veneration of saints does NOT contradict Sola Scriptura, at least insofar that it is truly veneration and not worship.

The question still remains, where is even that watered-down version of Sola Scriptura, -- nothing essential to salvation and holy living can be outside scripture, -- in the Bible? (at this point you are excused muttering "give them Catholics a finger, they bite off the arm")

That baptism of children is without example is incorrect. When the scripture tells us "she got baptised and her entire household", the natural reading is that the children were baptised to regardless of age. We sure don't read "the entire household converted and therefore was baptized" (Acts 16:15, 16:33, with slight variations). What we have here is the idea of sponsorship: the parent or another believer undertakes to bring the children in the faith, and that allows baptism of children. You start with the assumption that for baptism to have an effect independent of the faith of the baptisee is "works based", and allow that assumption to cloud your reading.

We see no priests in the NT

"Presbyteros" is "priest", numerous occurences.

nor any instruction or example of church officers taking confession.

That was my point, there is no example. The Church developed the norm regaridng the secrecy of the confessional on the general authorization to "bind and loose" in matters pertaining to salvation (and the rule of scripture was not mentioned in it). But the instruction certainly is there, John 20:22-23.

4,745 posted on 01/18/2010 9:24:40 PM PST by annalex (http://www.catecheticsonline.com/CatenaAurea.php)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4735 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson