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To: Dr. Eckleburg; 1000 silverlings; the_conscience; blue-duncan; RnMomof7; HarleyD

“To base man’s election of any kind of righteous work he may or may not perform, particularly the righteous act of belief in Christ, is to return the church to Rome where men presume their pious actions will store up God’s favor on their behalf.”

HOGWASH!

Find another bogeyman, because that one is too silly to scare.

God seeks us out, and presents us with a choice. Why do I say he gives us a choice? Because otherwise he is a liar when he commands us to repent and believe. Because scripture is filled, from beginning to end, with the need for us to choose.

What did God tell Cain - and since Cain was dead in his sin, how could he have heard God to find out what God was saying?

“”Why are you angry, and why has your face fallen? 7 If you do well, will you not be accepted? And if you do not do well, sin is crouching at the door. Its desire is for you, but you must rule over it.” - Gen 4

“”Now therefore fear the LORD and serve him in sincerity and in faithfulness. Put away the gods that your fathers served beyond the River and in Egypt, and serve the LORD. 15 And if it is evil in your eyes to serve the LORD, choose this day whom you will serve, whether the gods your fathers served in the region beyond the River, or the gods of the Amorites in whose land you dwell. But as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD.” - Joshua 24

” 37Now when they heard this they were cut to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, “Brothers, what shall we do?” 38And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39For the promise is for you and for your children and for all who are far off, everyone whom the Lord our God calls to himself.” 40And with many other words he bore witness and continued to exhort them, saying, “Save yourselves from this crooked generation.” - Acts 2

“3For what does the Scripture say? “Abraham believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness.” 4Now to the one who works, his wages are not counted as a gift but as his due. 5And to the one who does not work but believes in him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is counted as righteousness...” - Romans 4

Notice: “And to the one who does not work but believes in him who justifies the ungodly” - belief is not “work”, save in the sense Jesus taught, “This is the work of God, that you believe in him whom he has sent.”

“19For though I am free from all, I have made myself a servant to all, that I might win more of them. 20 To the Jews I became as a Jew, in order to win Jews. To those under the law I became as one under the law (though not being myself under the law) that I might win those under the law. 21To those outside the law I became as one outside the law (not being outside the law of God but under the law of Christ) that I might win those outside the law. 22 To the weak I became weak, that I might win the weak. I have become all things to all people, that by all means I might save some.” - 1 Cor 9

Who does Paul think he is? Does he think he shares in the work of the Gospel? “ I have become all things to all people, that by all means I might save some.”

” 15We ourselves are Jews by birth and not Gentile sinners; 16yet we know that a person is not justified by works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, so we also have believed in Christ Jesus, in order to be justified by faith in Christ and not by works of the law...” - Galatians 2

“If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.” - 1 John 1

“19 Those whom I love, I reprove and discipline, so be zealous and repent. 20Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and eat with him, and he with me. 21 The one who conquers, I will grant him to sit with me on my throne, as I also conquered and sat down with my Father on his throne.” - Rev 3

He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.


2,554 posted on 01/13/2010 9:14:50 AM PST by Mr Rogers (I loathe the ground he slithers on!)
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To: Mr Rogers; HarleyD; blue-duncan; the_conscience; RnMomof7; Gamecock; wmfights; Alex Murphy
God seeks us out, and presents us with a choice

Certainly. And those whom He has renerated will choose wisely and those who have not been regenerated will choose poorly.

You are arguing for man to have the final (and thus absolute) say in his own salvation.

No wonder you dismiss the sovereignty of God as easily as you did in the other post, and now call it "Hogwash.".

Rome is delighted by your post.

"See," Rome chuckles, "We told you you had to work for it."

"Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?

Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?" -- Romans 9:20-21


2,561 posted on 01/13/2010 9:45:40 AM PST by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
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To: Mr Rogers; Dr. Eckleburg; 1000 silverlings; the_conscience; blue-duncan; RnMomof7; HarleyD
What did God tell Cain - and since Cain was dead in his sin, how could he have heard God to find out what God was saying?

He heard him through his conscience which all men retain this image of God despite the Fall. But for those dead in their sins this conscience can only convict it has no power by itself to renew the sinner.

But if a person is not dead in sins and trespasses, then the character of the work of salvation is entirely changed. Christ may then have acquired the possibility of salvation, but salvation itself is not His work. All of His priestly office becomes superfluous and falls away; there is no longer any place for His sacrifice. It is suffiecient that He was a prophet who proclaimed the truth and, by means of that preaching, arouses a person to faith and repentance, so that along this route a person himself acquires salvation.

For many, this Remonstrant pathway seems to create the possibility of heavenly redemption. In fact, however, it removes this possibility for thousands and for millions. For if, as was saiid at the conference in The Hague, the Word of God is the only seed of regeneration, then every infant dying in infancy, everyone who is mentally impaired, and everyone suffering from mental incapacity is excluded from salvation. Even worse, one is compelled to contradict Scripture in its simple declaration that Christ is the way, the truth, and the life, that no one can come to the Father except through Him, and that no other name is given under heaven whereby men are to be saved than the name of Jesus alone.
(Bavinck,Saved by Grace, p24)


2,562 posted on 01/13/2010 9:46:40 AM PST by the_conscience (True Americans do not insist on politically correct speech codes.)
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