Who are the Catholics: The Orthodox or The Romanists, or both?

Me

[Mr Rogers]

“My guess is that you being in the Military and all, that you must have bowed in front of a coffin of a deceased soldier in honor of his life?”

Salute, yes.

In all seriousness, motive is critical.

My pastor was raised...barely Catholic? His parents went to Mass perhaps 2-3 times/year. However, he mentioned last week that they had several statues of saints in his house, and his parents would sometimes pray TO them. Not, XYZ, join me in prayer, but XYZ, do this for me.

They always had a saint statue on their dashboard, and at Christmas, they would join some other relatives and were supposed to pray at a wall of statues.

THAT is wrong, and I think you’ll agree.

But bowing in respect, or using a statue (or costume) to remember what someone’s life meant? That is fine by me - IF it is done to show respect and in thankfulness to God. If that is the motive, then anyone complaining about a bow is just ill-mannered, IMHO.

[the_conscience]

what potty language?

[Mr Rogers]

“The Defense Authorization Act of 2009, signed by “W”, allows un-uniformed service-members, military retirees, and veterans to render a hand salute during the hoisting, lowering, or passing of the U.S. flag and during the national anthem.”

THANKS! I didn’t know that. I’ll admit, a salute FEELS more natural.

[stfassisi]

We are required to be impersonal on the RF. I actually learned how from a Protestant. And "Romanism" is a slur

RM, Judith Anne brings up a valid point- Romanism is a slur and I think you should not allow this anymore if you're really being fair

[Judith Anne]

Oh, do you want to play “Trivial Pursuit” this morning? Because every properly catechized Catholic knows that God rejected Cain’s offering, and he was jealous so he slew his brother Abel and hid his body. Whence we get that wonderfully sinful phrase, “Am I my brother’s keeper?” which was Cain’s answer to God’s question, “Where is Abel?”

[Mad Dawg]

You and I are done.

[annalex]

Saints are our friends, the distinctions I made was with "friends in this life". Yes, some are living saints.

I think, many Catholics, bombarded by anti-Catholic propaganda, adopt that apologetic tone: "Yeah, we ask for the prayers of the saints but that is no different than you asking a friend to pray" or "we don't really bow to them", etc.

The fact is, we don't venerate, bow, prostrate, pray to, display images of, talk to, sing to, wisper to, yell to saints enough, if we are serious about loving God.

God gave us a gift and we apologize about it.

No way.

When are the Protestants going to apologize for their barren places of worship? That is the real scandal here.

Madonna and Child between St Francis and St Anthony

Donatello

1448
Bronze, height 147, 160 and 145 cm
Basilica di Sant'Antonio, Padua

[Mr Rogers]

Found this once I knew to look for it:

“The exact language of the act reads:

“Members of the Armed Forces and veterans who are present but not in uniform may render the military salute. All other persons present should face the flag and stand at attention with their right hand over the heart, or if applicable, remove their headdress with their right hand and hold it at the left shoulder, the hand being over the heart.” (Emphasis added.)

From this language, it appears to be acceptable for veterans not in uniform to render a military salute whether or not they are covered. And since it says, “all others” should remove their (covers), that seems to say it’s acceptable for veterans who are saluting the flag to remain covered while doing so, but it is not necessary for them to be covered.

This particular language only covered saluting the flag when it was being raised or lowered, or was passing. The Defense Authorization Act of 2009 now clarifies that this provision also applies during the performance of the National Anthem or the reciting of the Pledge of Allegiance.

On the one hand, common sense would seem to say that in determining their course of action, veterans might simply render the same honors they would if in uniform. That seems to help simplify matters for many...

...I noted an astute comment on another discussion board by RADM John Bepko, USN (retired), former Deputy Commander, Military Sealift Command, who said,

“This issue of saluting when “Covered or not covered;” “in civilian clothes or uniform” is for the most part TOTALLY misunderstood by so many of you.

You, as American Citizens, have the right to honor the flag in whatever way suits you - as long as you violate no laws against desecration of the flag - and there are too few of those.

ALL Veterans were ALWAYS given the option of saluting. Who would ever tell them not to???

The new ‘Law’ changes nothing - just states what is a common practice.

I have saluted, and will always salute my flag -in uniform or out - covered or not. I, and all my fellow veterans have earned that right.

Stop quibbling over nonsense . . . you always had this right.”

http://www.military-money-matters.com/veterans-salute-the-flag-covered-or-not.html

[Admin Moderator]

You should know quite well what I am talking about.

[Mad Dawg]

For me, a critical principle is the "Lilies that fester" one. We can say, again and again, for example, that sexual intercourse is created good, is a natural good, and so forth. But there will still be people who will think and will teach their children and students that sexual intercourse is inherently wicked.

Similarly, we can talk about the intercession of the Saints, about how they have nothing that was not given, yatta yatta. There will still be people who are going to make demi-gods and devas of the saints.

Stretch Pelousy has NO understanding of free will, so she says that the Church gives her permission to disagree with our long standing prohibition of abortion. I don't know how anybody can get "Stretch" to listen up.

As Tallulah Bankhead is reported to have said, when invited to use the word "horticulture" in a sentence, "You can lead a horticulture, but you can't make her think." (Somehow, I'm getting to Tucson.)

[Religion Moderator]

Words and phrases which some find offensive others do not, e.g. Romanist, Roman Catholic, dear, Proddy, Papist, affiliate, edifice, Morman.

And some of those terms appear in religious documents and articles which could be the subject of "open" Religion Forum debate where thick skin is required.

If I determine a word or phrase is too offensive for open religious debate, I will let you know.

[RnMomof7]

So then God does not accept bloodless sacrifices right??

[Judith Anne]

Well, I am a convert to the Catholic Church, and I never got into the habit and never wanted to, but after all this hair-splitting over bowing or not bowing, I think I’ll just start bowing, genuflecting, and maybe even curtseying to everything that reminds me of Christ, is a representation of Christ, statues and pictures of saints, etc.

[stfassisi]

Are there some abuses? Certainly,but if we stay within the guidelines of what the Church teaches regarding intercessory prayer It’s OK.

I’ll try and post guidelines of intercessory prayer later unless someone else here wants to do it.

If I don’t get my chores done my wife is going to rightfully blast me when she gets home

I wish you a Blessed day!

[Judith Anne]

What?

[Judith Anne]

sorry, just want to let you know that “judithann” won’t ping me, she is a different poster.

[Iscool]

One world global authority is the invention of a stiff-necked Calvinist Presbyterian, Woodrow Wilson, America’s first fascist president.

I'd say you're off by a few centuries...

[Judith Anne]

When you do have time, I will read that post with interest. Have a great day yourself.