Who are the Catholics: The Orthodox or The Romanists, or both?

Me

[the_conscience]

I just witnessed a couple of Orthodox posters get kicked off a "Catholic Caucus" thread. I thought, despite their differences, they had a mutual understanding that each sect was considered "Catholic". Are not the Orthodox considered Catholic? Why do the Romanists get to monopolize the term "Catholic"?

I consider myself to be Catholic being a part of the universal church of Christ. Why should one sect be able to use a universal concept to identify themselves in a caucus thread while other Christian denominations need to use specific qualifiers to identify themselves in a caucus thread?

[wagglebee]

So the dictionary definition that those who profess faith in Christ as Catholic does not create a reason to look at the tag because it includes those outside those churches associated with Rome?

The dictionary definition you posted was INCOMPLETE.

Catholic with a capital "C" is a PROPER NOUN and refers to the Catholic Church and its members. Catholic with a lower-case "C" is an ADJECTIVE which means universal.

[Dr. Eckleburg]

We’ll add them to the list. 8~)

[theanonymouslurker]

So the dictionary definition that those who profess faith in Christ as Catholic does not create a reason to look at the tag because it includes those outside those churches associated with Rome?

C'mon, just say it. What do you believe that "Catholic Caucus" threads be redesignated as?

[the_conscience]

uhh... no actually if you look at the definition I posted it does not delineate between proper noun and adjective. Both definitions by Merriam are considered proper nouns.

[sitetest]

Dear Religion Moderator,

Although I am generally critical of the basic rules of decorum of this forum as intrinsically flawed, on this issue, you appear in my mind to be calling it rightly.

Ask a thousand folks on the street what it means to be “Catholic,” and they’ll point to membership in churches in communion with the See of Peter.

Similarly, the term “Orthodox Christian” will elicit thoughts of the Ecumenical Patriarch and those in communion with him.

Most folks will understand “Protestant” as folks neither Catholic nor Orthodox but nonetheless Christian.

Some folks will think that “Mormon” (or “LDS”) is just one denomination of Christianity, others that it is a non-Christian religion, but all will agree that it has to do with the ecclesial community headquartered in Salt Lake City.

I would recommend one more primary caucus label for consideration: “Non-Catholic/Non-Orthodox Christian.”

The label “Christian Caucus” wouldn’t exclude either Catholics or Orthodox.

“Dispensationalist,” “Baptist,” etc., may be too sectarian, too narrow for those who are neither Catholic nor Orthodox but who would wish to caucus together across their other various ecclesial boundaries.

As a Catholic, I’da gone with “Protestant Caucus,” as those who are Trinitarian Christians who are neither Catholic nor Orthodox (including the Churches of the East that are apostolic but in communion with neither the See of Rome or Constantinople) all look like Protestants to me. But some folks have objected that they’re not Protestants, so perhaps the “Non-Catholic/Non-Orthodox Caucus” label might be preferable to these folks.

Just a thought.

sitetest

[the_conscience]

I suggested to another poster: Churches associated with the Roman Bishop (or CAWTRB if you prefer).

[wagglebee]

actually if you look at the definition I posted

I did, you omitted the part which was inconvenient to you.

[the_conscience]

And you disregarded the fact that the initial definition is considered a proper noun.

[Dr. Eckleburg]

The Catholic Church is the Universal Church founded by Christ circa AD 33.

The Catholic Christian Church is the catholic, universal church founded by Christ circa AD 33 and ordained by God from before the foundation of the world.

(Corrected for the edification of His saints.)

[the_conscience]

The labeling of a caucus on the Religion Forum does not need to comply with dictionary definitions.

I can appreciate that but it is disconcerting that a select group can use a universal conception that excludes those who believe they belong to that universal.

[theanonymouslurker]

I suggested to another poster: Churches associated with the Roman Bishop (or CAWTRB if you prefer).

Thanks. You've confirmed for all that the whole point of your little game here is to hijack the Religion Forum protocols to support your twisted view of Catholic ecclesiology. How..... childish.

[markomalley]

Pure Romanist? Now there's an oxymoron.

Of course, how silly of me. Absolutely everything taught by Rome is hogwash (your word, not mine). I forgot.

You've proven nothing.

And you've proven plenty. Plenty.

[Religion Moderator]

A "Christian Caucus" would indeed include Catholic and Orthodox Freepers.

Various non-Catholic caucuses have been labeled LDS, Protestant, Reformed, etc. We've even had an Atheist caucus.

The Dispensationalists also have caucused so that they could discuss prophecy without objection by the Preterists who have not yet caucused, but could if they wanted. Specific denominations have also caucused.

And of course non-denominations have caucused.

Creationists have caucused. Theistic evolutionists are welcome to do the same.

Obviously a Freeper may be a member of more than one caucus.

At least one Hindu is contemplating calling a caucus. Muslim Freepers are welcome to caucus. Ditto for Scientologists. Obviously, some Freepers need to call a caucus to air their beliefs.

However, it may be necessary from time-to-time to have threads such as this one to clarify the meaning of certain caucus labels.

[Religion Moderator]

“Open” Religion Forum threads such as this one are the proper places to air such greivances.

[wagglebee]

And you disregarded the fact that the initial definition is considered a proper noun.

There is NOTHING to disregard, NOTHING in the first definition indicates that it is a proper noun.

For the record, if you received a proper Christian baptism, the Catholic Church considers you to be a member of the Catholic Church, but not in full communion with the Church.

Here is the definition from Webster's 1828 Dictionary:

CATHOLIC, a.

1. Universal or general; as the Catholic church. Originally this epithet was given to the Christian church in general, but is now appropriated to the Romish church, and in strictness there is no Catholic church, or universal Christian communion. The epithet is sometimes set in opposition to heretic, sectary or schismatic.

2. Liberal; not narrow minded, partial or bigoted; as a catholic man.

3. Liberal; as catholic principles.

Catholic epistles, the epistles of the apostles which are addressed to all the faithful, and not to a particular church.

CATHOLIC, n. A papist

[the_conscience]

I’m merely reiterating what those from your sect suggest is the ecclesiology.

[markomalley]

What do you believe that "Catholic Caucus" threads be redesignated as?

I tried "Papist Scum Caucus" this morning, but apparently somebody didn't note the evidential brilliance of that designation and deleted the thread.

;-)

[sitetest]

Dear Religion Moderator,

There is a crowd here that sometimes finds Catholic participation objectionable, but is otherwise welcome to all other Christians.

Thus, my suggestion was meant for that crowd. I chose “Non-Catholic/Non-Orthodox Christians,” because although these folks might not realize it, they may find the participation of Orthodox Christians often objectionable for many of the same reasons as they find the participation of Catholics objectionable.

“Protestant Caucus” works well from my point of view, as that's what they're all to me. When I see non-Catholic, non-Orthodox Christians, my eyes inform me that I'm looking at Protestants. But in recent years I've been somewhat taken aback at the number of these folks who bristle at the name “Protestant.”

And it's not just at FR. My son's math teacher last year was a Lutheran (yes, a Lutheran teacher at a Catholic school - see how ecumenical we can be??). In fact, her husband is a Lutheran pastor. It was a lot of fun when my son informed her that Luther was a pervert heretic most likely burning in the lower reaches of Hell. She took that all in good humor. But she bristled when my son called her a Protestant.

This is as goofy to me as it gets. I mean, come on! Old Luther (wherever he is) was the ORIGINAL Protestant!! He got the whole damned ball rolling (and to us Catholics, the “ball” is indeed damned)! But here it was, this nice, quiet lady, the wife of a Lutheran pastor, unhappy to be called a Protestant. LOL.

Anyway, that's why I made the suggestion. It may just be splitting the hair too finely. Maybe it's just my “inner Jesuit” coming out. LOL. Maybe “Protestant Caucus” works just fine.

sitetest

[wagglebee]

I suggested to another poster: Churches associated with the Roman Bishop (or CAWTRB if you prefer).

What's wrong with "'MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH' Caucus"? Another poster last week seemed to think that this was a fine term to describe the Catholic Church.

[the_conscience]

There is NOTHING to disregard, NOTHING in the first definition indicates that it is a proper noun.

There is just no end to your duplicity, is there? So by introducing a different dictionary definition that somehow allows you to claim that you did not disregard the Merriam definition? Incredible duplicity!

Main Entry:
Cath·o·lic
Pronunciation: \ˈkath-lik, ˈka-thə-\
Function: noun
Date: 15th century
1 : a person who belongs to the universal Christian church