“’Do you believe that being a Baptist is important to getting to Heaven or not?’
“No.”
Okay. Then from my perspective, I don't know why one would be a Baptist. Why not go be a Presbyterian? Or heck, a rastafarian (they believe in Jesus, sort of) or a Mormon (they believe in Jesus). It's all the same, right? Or not?
“In the end I have to have faith that the Holy Spirit will direct them where they should go.”
Did you ever hear the joke about the guy who is caught in a terrible flood, and he climbs up on the roof of his house, and he prays to God to rescue him, and God says that He will, and He's coming? And a boat comes to get him, and another boat, and finally a helicopter. And to each he says, “No thank you, God is going to rescue me.” And then he drowns. He gets to Heaven and asks God, “Hey, you told me you were going to rescue me from that flood. What happened?” And God answers, “I sent two boats and a helicopter, whaddaya want??”
The point being that God works through us, as well. It is my duty as a father to help guide my children. That's what this thread is about, how Catholic parents should help guide their children. For us, we may not say, “Oh, we'll leave it all to the Holy Spirit, and He'll make it turn out all right.” Things don't always turn out all right. Some folks go to Hell. And some folks who eventually get to Heaven often go to a hell of their own making, unncessarily, to get there.
“As far as the abandoning the faith stuff we don't believe the Holy Spirit jumps in and out of believers. If they truly believe THE GOSPEL they will end up being planted in a Christian environment.”
We're Catholic, we don't believe in the doctrine of once saved, always saved. We believe that someone can fall away from the faith, and that that can very well lead to damnation.
“Interesting that you would draw satanism into it.”
It's a logical device to use the most extreme example to help illustrate a point that may have applicability in less extreme examples.
“’Truer than Baptist or Presbyterian faith. So why would we want our children to give up what is better for that which is lesser?’
“Thank you for your honesty. How can a lesser be an equal?”
You're welcome. So, do you think that your Baptist faith is NOT truer than my Catholic faith? Are both equally true?
Nonetheless, your posts still aren't quite correct. As a Catholic, I certainly believe that Catholic faith is superior to Baptist or Presbyterian faith, and that these religions are inferior to Catholic faith. In fact, the Catholic Church teaches that the communities of Baptist or Presbyterian believers are not even actual ontological churches. The Catholic Church may sometimes refer to these as “ecclesial communities.”
But the Christians who call themselves Baptists or Presbyterians, in what sense are they inferior? Their BELIEF is inferior, from our perspective, but they are not inferior in their personhood, they are not morally inferior, they are not less loved by God, less deserving of good things, more needful of salvation, more sinful.
We Catholics are not morally or spiritually or socially superior in any way. We merely believe that the faith that we hold is the fullness of faith given by Jesus to the Apostles.
I have a friend whose mother left the Catholic Church and became a Methodist. The woman told my friend that she became a Methodist because it seems that the people in the Methodist community are better, less sinful. My friend didn't know how to respond. I told her that her mother was probably right. The Catholic Church is for sinners, especially the worst sort, because we need the strongest “medicine.”
“The Catholic Church is for saints and sinners alone. For respectable people, the Anglican Church will do.”
- Oscar Wilde
“My wife was RC. We went to her church for awhile. I started going to mine, she joined me and she never looked back.”
From the Catholic perspective, someone who leaves the Catholic Church puts his or her soul in jeopardy. For us it is a sad and frightening thing. Whether you agree with what we think and believe or not, you present me with precisely the evidence that makes me teach my sons not to marry outside the Catholic Church.
Thank you for the illustration that Patrick Madrid is right in what he says.
sitetest
As a Christian I have no problem if my children join another Bible believing church. Throwing the non Bible believing churches into the mix is not the same thing and only serves to confuse the issue, unless the view is that any non RCC is "defective".
We're Catholic, we don't believe in the doctrine of once saved, always saved. We believe that someone can fall away from the faith, and that that can very well lead to damnation.
I know. RC's have a hard time understanding Blessed Assurance.
It's a logical device to use the most extreme example to help illustrate a point that may have applicability in less extreme examples.
Or is it to illustrate that non RCC's aren't really Christian?
So, do you think that your Baptist faith is NOT truer than my Catholic faith?
I think the lens is so different RC's can't see that Evangelicals do not see their church as their faith.
From the Catholic perspective, someone who leaves the Catholic Church puts his or her soul in jeopardy.
I know, it's to bad.