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To: Campion

Explain Catechism 841, then.

And is it your contention that the Catholic Church assumes all Protestants are saved? That you can be saved outside the Church?


69 posted on 09/06/2009 9:48:19 PM PDT by PugetSoundSoldier (Indignation over the Sting of Truth is the Defense of the Indefensible)
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To: PugetSoundSoldier
Explain Catechism 841, then.

Okay: The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims

You need to interpret this according to Catholic teaching dating back to Aquinas and before, not according to anyone else's understanding.

It amounts to saying: "It's very nice that Muslims 'acknowledge the Creator'. We cannot say with certainty that God, who wills all men to be saved and come to knowledge of the truth, will not save some Muslims -- in spite of the errors they hold."

It is in no sense a claim that all Muslims are going to heaven. Don't you think we'd first have to decide that all Catholics are going to heaven ... yet we don't; the only Catholics the church teaches infallibly are saved are canonized saints.

And is it your contention that the Catholic Church assumes all Protestants are saved?

As I just explained, we don't assume that all Catholics are saved. (Haven't you ever read Dante's "Inferno," which depicts hell filled with wicked Popes and bishops?)

That you can be saved outside the Church?

Absolutely, positively, nobody will be saved outside the Catholic Church. Not Muslims, not Protestants, nobody.

That is not the same as saying that only people who profess Catholicism on earth will be saved.

It is the same as saying that there will not be a Muslim heaven, not a Baptist heaven, not a Jewish heaven. All religious disunity on earth is the consequence of sin. There is one "church" in heaven only, and it is universal ... the Greek word is "catholic".

74 posted on 09/06/2009 10:04:00 PM PDT by Campion ("President Barack Obama" is an anagram for "An Arab-backed Imposter")
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To: PugetSoundSoldier

***And is it your contention that the Catholic Church assumes all Protestants are saved? That you can be saved outside the Church?***

How many times on how many threads do you need this answered?


95 posted on 09/07/2009 6:51:12 AM PDT by MarkBsnr ( I would not believe in the Gospel if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so.)
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