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To: Melian

“all your study and inquiry is based on the belief that only Scripture matters. If you have viewed Church history though that prism, you have viewed it with a bias.”

I admit to that, pretty much. It’s not so much that only Scripture MATTERS, as much as it is the supreme authority on doctrinal issues, for me.

I do agree that Christ promised to guide His Church forever. Perhaps we differ as to how. I do believe the Bible, the Holy Spirit making it clear to us, and God’s providence are the primary methods.


40 posted on 07/19/2009 5:46:57 PM PDT by Marie2 (The second mouse gets the cheese.)
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To: Marie2

“I admit to that, pretty much. It’s not so much that only Scripture MATTERS, as much as it is the supreme authority on doctrinal issues, for me.”

Scripture cannot be the supreme authority for the simple reason that the Gospels were not written for many years after Christ died. Until they were written, the supreme authority on doctrinal issues was Peter and his successors. Christ set it up that way. The Scriptures didn’t exist and Christ selected oral Church teaching as His method of evangelization.

In addition, Christ set up His Church knowing full well that He was using foolish and sometimes sinful men. Peter’s weaknesses were well known to Christ. Still, he selected Peter, warts and all. He wanted frail humans, guided by the Holy Spirit, spreading the faith. He knew the Church would not always be perfect and He never promised it would be. What He promised was that His Church would last forever and that the apostolic leadership would be guided by the Spirit. He said He would not leave us orphans.

If you believe Scripture, you know that the Holy Spirit enlightened the minds of the Apostles and Mary on Pentecost. From the very first days, those enlightened minds set up the Mass and a hierarchy of Church leadership. If you believe Scripture, do a real study of what the early Church actually did. You will find it remarkably similar to the practices of the Catholic Church of today.

Finally, the Scriptures that we both hold so dear are the ones the Catholic Church’s leaders deemed divinely inspired. The formal Catholic Church selected which writings were to be included in the New Testament and which weren’t divinely inspired. How did they decide that? Well, they relied on Church tradition, oral teaching, and the guidance of the Holy Spirit. So the Scripture you are relying on as a final authority was compiled and protected through the ages by the Catholic Church. How could they get that right and nothing else? Did the Holy Spirit guide them on just this issue? In the 16th century, men began altering the translations and leaving passages out as it suited them and their own agendas.

It would seem to me that if you want to use Scripture as the supreme authority on doctrinal issues, you would at least want to use the text as it was originally written, not after men have tinkered with it. Go back to the first ancient versions of Scripture and you will find something closer to the Truth. You will also find that Catholic teaching, tradition, and dogma are completely scriptural.

If you really want to know what the Church teaches, without the bias or self-preservation a minister might include in his explanations and teachings to you, I invite you to refer to the Catechism of the Catholic Church. Every concept is spelled out clearly with references to the Scriptural passage that relates to it. Then cross-reference with a good Catholic Bible which will contain books and passages you may never have seen...passages that have existed in the Bible since it was written.

I will pray for you, Marie, and I hope that God blesses you always.


60 posted on 07/19/2009 7:31:46 PM PDT by Melian ("Now, Y'all without sin can cast the first stone." ~H.I. McDunnough)
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