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To: Petronski
Neither is the word Trinity. Do you reject the Trinity?

No Christian can reject the concept of the Trinity. The concept of the trinity is heavily supported and defined and made truth by the Bible.

Of course not. Christ founded the Catholic Church, not the thing you described.

Let's play your game. Where is the word "Catholic" in the Bible?

Even better, where is the concept of a unitary leader of the church who can speak ex cathedra with the attendant impact of such speech, anywhere in the Bible?

345 posted on 06/28/2009 2:35:46 PM PDT by PugetSoundSoldier (Indignation over the sting of truth is the defense of the indefensible)
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To: PugetSoundSoldier
The concept of the trinity is heavily supported and defined and made truth by the Bible.

The concept of the Catholic Church is heavily supported and defined and made truth by the Bible.

Let's play your game.

It's not MY game, it's been yours from the start.

Where is the word "Catholic" in the Bible?

Where is Sola Scriptura in the Bible?

Where is the word Trinity in the Bible?

Even better, where is the concept of a unitary leader of the church who can speak ex cathedra with the attendant impact of such speech, anywhere in the Bible?

Even better still, where is sola Scriptura in the Bible?

348 posted on 06/28/2009 2:40:44 PM PDT by Petronski (In Germany they came first for the Communists, And I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist...)
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To: PugetSoundSoldier

PugetSoundSoldier:

The concept of Primacy is rooted in the Gospels, for example, in MT: 16:16-19 we see Christ only speaking to the Apostles (e.g. The Twelve) as the parallel texts support (c.f. Mark 8: 27-30; Luke 9:18-21). Every Christian does not have the power to “bind and loose”. This was given only to the Apostles. So, after Judas betrayal and death, Peter called the Apostles together and quoted the Psalms and said “may another take his office” (c.f. Acts 1:20). In Acts 1:26, Mathias was counted with the eleven other apostles and we now have a reconstituted twelve apostles. So again, the power to bind and loose is given to all the Apostles (not every Christian) but St. Peter alone is named the “rock” given the keys.

Two points, St. Paul states “you are members of the household of God, built upon the foundation of the Apostles and prophets with Christ as the capstone” (c.f. Eph 2:20) and the “keys” are a typological sign that is found in the OT and is an OT symbol of authority (c.f. Isaiah 22: 15-23) and prefigures the role Christ gave to St. Peter. Other important texts consistent with Peter having a leadership role among the Apostles can be found in the Gospels.

For example, Jesus prays for Peter alone, that his faith may not fail, and charges him to strengthen the rest of the apostles (c.f.. Luke 22:31-32). After asking Peter 3 times do you love me [to fully atone for the 3-fold denial at Christ’s trial] Jesus charges Peter to “feed my lambs,” “tend my sheep,” “feed my sheep., which in this context means both the fellow Apostles and all of the Christian people. (c.f. John 21:15-17).

In two resurrection narratives, St. John arrives first to the tomb but waits for St. Peter to arrive, who then enters the tomb first (c.f. Lk 24:12; John 20-4-6).
As previously noted in the Acts 1, we see St. Peter taking the role in re-establishing the 12 Apostles. After Pentecost, it is St. Peter who preaches the Gospel first (c.f. Acts 2:14), it is St. Peter who works the first miracle (c.f. Acts 3:6-7), it is St. Peter who issues the first excommunication against Ananias and Sapphira (c.f. Acts 5: 3). St. Peter resolves the doctrinal issues of dietary laws for the gentiles at the Council of Jerusalem (c.f. Acts 15: 6-12).

Also, we see in 1 Peter 5:13 “The Chosen one at Bablyon sends you greetings, as does my son Mark” [NAB translation.] In the RSV, my personal favorite, as it is the most accurate according to most Catholic scholars, translates 1 Peter 5:13 as “She who is at Babylon, who is likewise chosen, sends you greetings and so does my son Mark”.

This passage indicates the underlying concept that the Church of Rome was elected/chosen, etc. and St. Peter was the leader there as affirmed by the writings of the Church Fathers (i.e St Ignatius of Antioch CA 105-107AD, ST. Ireneaus of Lyon, CA 175 AD, etc), who both affirm the Primacy of the Church of Rome which was of course dogmatically recognized at the Council of Nicea in Canon 6, see link below.

http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/3801.htm


357 posted on 06/28/2009 2:56:14 PM PDT by CTrent1564
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