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To: Dutchboy88; Dr. Eckleburg

I explained what free will is several times. It is a capacity to choose between courses of action that is left after all the limitations and influences have been counted in. The passage from Paul only says that choices for the good are difficult to make, and were it not for the grace of Christ, impossible. But they do not deny free will — it is referenced right in the passage, as I pointed out.

This capacity to choose is not mere feeling, it is real. The scripture tells us that we are judged by our works (Romans 2, Matthew 25, James 2). God would not judge us by illusory things that we actually have no input into.

I understand that Calvinism teaches different. My job here is to explain what the Catholic Church teaches. I believe I did that exhaustively, but if you have further questions, please pose them.


297 posted on 07/06/2009 12:14:19 PM PDT by annalex (http://www.catecheticsonline.com/CatenaAurea.php)
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To: annalex; Dutchboy88
This capacity to choose is not mere feeling, it is real.

And thus you have given a shoddy understanding of the work Christ performed on Lazarus. No man can know the things of God, let alone live according to His perfect law, unless and until that man is born again by the Holy spirit. Like all humanists, the RCC under-estimates the effects of the fall.

* John 8:34 - "Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who commits sin is the slave of sin."

* 2 Peter 2:19 - by what a man is overcome, by this he is enslaved.

* Titus 3:3 - For we also once were foolish ourselves, disobedient, deceived, enslaved to various lusts and pleasures, spending our life in malice and envy, hateful, hating one another.

* Galatians 4:8-9 - However at that time, when you did not know God, you were slaves to those which by nature are no gods. But now that you have come to know God, or rather to be known by God, how is it that you turn back again to the weak and worthless elemental things, to which you desire to be enslaved all over again?

* Romans 6:6,16,17,19,20 - our old self was crucified with Him, in order that our body of sin might be done away with, so that we would no longer be slaves to sin... Do you not know that when you present yourselves to someone as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey...? But thanks be to God that though you were slaves of sin, you became obedient from the heart... For just as you presented your members as slaves to impurity and to lawlessness, resulting in further lawlessness, so now present your members as slaves to righteousness, resulting in sanctification. For when you were slaves of sin, you were free in regard to righteousness.

* Romans 7:14 - For we know that the Law is spiritual, but I am of flesh, sold into bondage to sin.

* Romans 6:20 - For when you were slaves of sin, you were free in regard to righteousness.

* 2 Timothy 2:25-26 - if perhaps God may grant them repentance leading to the knowledge of the truth, and they may come to their senses and escape from the snare of the devil, having been held captive by him to do his will.


302 posted on 07/06/2009 1:00:10 PM PDT by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
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To: annalex

No you “explained” that you and the RCC believe a mish-mash promise that God gave men free will. If you think this is supported in Scripture, start again and show us what verse in, say, Romans 7 supports Paul saying, “I have free will”.


306 posted on 07/06/2009 1:37:37 PM PDT by Dutchboy88
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