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Evangelical editor picks a quarrel with his cohorts (claims they have lost their way)
Charlotte Observer ^ | June 6, 2009 | Tim Funk

Posted on 06/12/2009 3:31:04 PM PDT by NYer

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Televangelist and best-selling author, Joel Osteen, right, and his wife, Victoria, left, celebrate the grand opening of the new home for the Lakewood Church, formerly the Compaq Center, Saturday, July 16, 2005, in Houston. The arena that basketball fans once packed to see the NBA's Houston Rockets is taking on a new role, home to the largest congregation in the nation. It took more than 15 months and $75 million to convert the arena into the new home of the largest and fastest growing congregation in the nation.(AP Photo/Jessica Kourkounis)
1 posted on 06/12/2009 3:31:04 PM PDT by NYer
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To: Salvation; narses; SMEDLEYBUTLER; redhead; Notwithstanding; nickcarraway; Romulus; ...
He'd prefer his fellow evangelicals join in the recitation of the Apostles Creed or extend a handshake of peace to a pew-mate.

“The liturgy understands that humans need to actively participate and not be spectators,” Smith said.

The above statement caught my eye. He is, of course, absolutely right.

2 posted on 06/12/2009 3:33:24 PM PDT by NYer ("Run from places of sin as from a plague." - St. John Climacus)
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To: NYer

Our PCA church was slipping into the ‘mega church’ state of mind a few years back... I’ll have to check out Smith’s book.


3 posted on 06/12/2009 3:42:32 PM PDT by sweet_diane (embracing Him.)
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To: NYer

A friend of mine has been attending a NJ church called “The Water” (or just Water (?) which has a lot of the feel-good stuff,uses big screens, has rock-style music, etc....BUT :
The group is said to be “full Bible” (whatever that means), and goes out of its way to perform good works-year round.

Members actually spend their vacations ministering to the poor, handing out clothing, food, toys, etc.,and generally “acting like Christians”.

They have relatively enormous attendance at their services-which are held in rented premises.

Which is “more Christian” ??


4 posted on 06/12/2009 3:47:47 PM PDT by mrmeangenes
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To: sweet_diane

I yearned for the Apostles’ Creed rather than the Mission Statement our church had. A wonderful church it was, and folks there loved the Lord. Maybe there was a cross on the stage, I think. Very simple inside.

We are loving the beauty of the Catholic Church now, and the historicity. (Hate the ditties, tho. I have to go to the early, silent Mass). We learned a lot in the Evangelical Church, left a lot of beloved friends, learned SO MUCH from the preaching. But these things are definitely missing.


5 posted on 06/12/2009 3:51:04 PM PDT by bboop (obama, little o, not a Real God)
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To: NYer
“Jesus is my boyfriend” songs

LOL! That's what our music director calls them!

Quick, the antidote:

O Sing Joyfully (Batten)

Listen for "blow up the trumpet in the new moon, e'en in the time appointed". A brilliant musical phrase. It almost takes your breath away.

6 posted on 06/12/2009 3:51:51 PM PDT by AnAmericanMother (Ministrix of ye Chasse, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary (recess appointment))
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To: bboop
Not all Catholic parishes are a musical wasteland.

Click on the post above for an anthem that we sang at communion two weeks ago -- Adrian Batten's "O Sing Joyfully". We sing a lot of the early English Renaissance motets and anthems -- Byrd, Tallis, Batten and the anonymous "Rejoice in the Lord Alway" (not the Purcell 'Bell Anthem' - but we sing that too. Both great, but the anonymous setting is a smaller, more intimate work.)

All the English stuff makes me feel very much at home as a former Anglican, but we also sing Palestrina, and Victoria, and Viadana - Exultate Justi

"We Give the Lie to Bad Catholic Music" ought to be our motto.

7 posted on 06/12/2009 3:58:58 PM PDT by AnAmericanMother (Ministrix of ye Chasse, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary (recess appointment))
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To: NYer
Sounds like a golden age for the evangelical church, right?

Wrong, says Warren Cole Smith,

In his new book Smith argues that many, if not most, evangelical churches have lost their way. Instead of sticking with core biblical principles, rich traditions and church-as-community, he says, they promote feel-goodism, technological fads and church-as-entertainment.

He's not the only one. There's a whole genre of books lately along the same line, by insiders.

Those I've read, published within the last year or two include Michael Horton, Christless Christianity, Julia Duin Quitting Church and David Wells, The Courage to be Protestant.

8 posted on 06/12/2009 3:59:59 PM PDT by Lee N. Field (Come, behold the works of the LORD, how he has brought desolations on the earth.)
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To: mrmeangenes

Small correction (due to senior moment): The church is called “Liquid Church of NJ”:

http://www.liquidchurch.com/

Sorry ‘bout that !


9 posted on 06/12/2009 4:05:08 PM PDT by mrmeangenes
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To: NYer
AMEN!
10 posted on 06/12/2009 4:06:00 PM PDT by Jemian (PAM of JT ~~ PAY GO: You pay and the Congress goes right on spending.)
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To: NYer

Christianity is a religion that requires study and mental discipline. Paul in 1 Timothy commands diligence in Bible study. But that often does not play well in the anti-intellectual TV age. Too many would rather like to go with the flow, let a preacher do their thinking for them and hope for some message from God while maximizing the emotion and avoiding the mental.


11 posted on 06/12/2009 4:10:46 PM PDT by Colonel Kangaroo
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To: mrmeangenes

I agree with you. Our church sings worship songs that are anointed and you can feel the presence of God in them (not all but most). They glorify God. We sing hymns as well. Many of our members have outreaches into the community and try to meet needs. They go on short-term missions trips and help orphanages or build needed buildings, send school supplies to Mexico, etc., etc. It grows by the year. We have a Christian School, which is our biggest mission. Our pastors and leadership are Godly men.


12 posted on 06/12/2009 4:16:46 PM PDT by Marysecretary (GOD IS STILL IN CONTROL!)
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To: NYer

Warren is a good friend. He and I used to attend an Episcopal Church together back when that was possible.


13 posted on 06/12/2009 4:17:53 PM PDT by Huber (And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not. - John 1:5)
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To: AnAmericanMother

Lovely, but it’s a concert choir and most churches don’t sing those beautiful sacred melodies with the kind of ability these choirs do. I do miss the old sacred songs and have tried to sing some of them, or did before I got sick.


14 posted on 06/12/2009 4:20:16 PM PDT by Marysecretary (GOD IS STILL IN CONTROL!)
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To: AnAmericanMother
Not all Catholic parishes are a musical wasteland.

I read the first line of your post, and I immediately knew that it was from you...

15 posted on 06/12/2009 4:20:19 PM PDT by Huber (And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not. - John 1:5)
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To: AnAmericanMother

You are blessed to have a group like that. envy, envy...


16 posted on 06/12/2009 4:20:59 PM PDT by Marysecretary (GOD IS STILL IN CONTROL!)
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To: mrmeangenes
Which is “more Christian” ??

You begin with the question: 'Why are we here?' We are here to know, love and serve God in this world and be happy with Him forever in the next. In order to love God, one must first know Him. In knowing God, we grow in love for Him and with that love comes a desire to serve Him.

Serving God and doing His will on earth. Worship is not "show time"; it's all about reverence. It's good that the community applies christian principles by ministering to the poor.

17 posted on 06/12/2009 4:23:19 PM PDT by NYer ("Run from places of sin as from a plague." - St. John Climacus)
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To: NYer

I agree with a few points. One thing i disagree is the music,
if we are to get young people into the church we must play the music they like.It does not need to be crude there are some great CCM artists out there.


18 posted on 06/12/2009 4:26:14 PM PDT by since1868 (I miss Pres Bush)
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To: mrmeangenes

THAT is how it should be!
Thanks for sharing!


19 posted on 06/12/2009 4:28:08 PM PDT by netmilsmom (Psalm 109:8 - Let his days be few; and let another take his office)
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To: Colonel Kangaroo
bump

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No charge on any of our materials.
Freely you've recieve so freely we give.
If any man is seeking it's available
You can't read through the list of what we have downloadable.
Video, Mp3, PDF.

20 posted on 06/12/2009 4:29:56 PM PDT by jokar (The Church age is the only time we will be able to Glorify God, http://www.gbible.org)
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