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Lutheran Leaders Respond to Slaying in Wichita Church
ELCA News Service ^
| 1 June AD 2009
| Staff
Posted on 06/01/2009 1:52:19 PM PDT by lightman
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To: XeniaSt
21
posted on
06/01/2009 2:50:28 PM PDT
by
Palladin
(Obama hates unborn babies.)
To: aberaussie
Lutheran Brothers and Sisters, I am sorry to hear about the state of your church. I don't know how it could have allowed that monster to be a member, let alone represent it as an usher. You might consider
coming home -- always has been pro-life, always will be. God bless.
22
posted on
06/01/2009 3:05:26 PM PDT
by
bdeaner
(The bread which we break, is it not a participation in the body of Christ? (1 Cor. 10:16))
To: bdeaner
Already done it...LCMS. Couldn't be happier at our new church!
My former church is doing well now that it no longer has a revisionist pastor.
To: aberaussie
Couldn't be happier at our new church!
Good to hear.
24
posted on
06/01/2009 3:16:21 PM PDT
by
bdeaner
(The bread which we break, is it not a participation in the body of Christ? (1 Cor. 10:16))
To: PhilCollins
I do understand that there are many ELCA members who are appalled at what’s going on in your denomination. Having learned that Tiller was a member of a church, it came as no surprise that it was an ELCA congregation. There are churches in a few other denominations that would also welcome a murderer like Tiller.
To: In veno, veritas; Palladin; Cletus.D.Yokel
Thank you for all your insights. Years ago I worked with a fellow who was Missouri Synod,
who shared some of features of different Lutheran denominations.
I knew that ELCA was liberal, but the Pastor and Pastorette
will receive special treatment for embracing and providing succor
to those who torture and murder of innocent children.
NAsbU James 3:1 Let not many of you become teachers,
my brethren, knowing that as such we will incur a stricter judgment.
NAsbU 2 Peter 2:1 But false prophets also arose among the people,
just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will
secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master
who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves.
shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiach
26
posted on
06/01/2009 6:26:07 PM PDT
by
Uri’el-2012
(Psalm 119:174 I long for Your salvation, YHvH, Your law is my delight.)
To: lightman
“I will set my face against that man and I will cut him off from his people; for by giving his children to Molech, he has defiled my sanctuary and profaned my holy name. If the people of the community close their eyes when that man gives one of his children to Molech and they fail to put him to death, I will set my face against that man and his family and will cut off from their people both him and all who follow him in prostituting themselves to Molech. “ Leviticus 20:3-5
To: kaehurowing
In the 1850’s Wichita’s state was called “bleeding Kansas”.
As I read your post the Battle Hymn of the Republic is playing in my head.
28
posted on
06/01/2009 7:51:44 PM PDT
by
lightman
(Adjutorium nostrum (+) in nomine Domini.)
To: lightman
This Lutheran stands with the Prophet Ezekiel: Would you have allowed George Tiller to be an usher at your Lutheran church?
29
posted on
06/01/2009 8:02:16 PM PDT
by
P-Marlowe
(LPFOKETT GAHCOEEP-w/o*)
To: MEGoody
I had prayed hard that Tillers eyes would be opened and he would turn from the sin of abortion. I am saddened that this mans life was ended before he repented.Of what sin should he have repented of?
Apparently he was fully accepted in the Lutheran Church as a member in good standing and as an Usher. He may have even baptized some of the babies he "prematurely delivered."
Obviously if he had some kind of ongoing sin in his life that required repentance, the Lutheran Church would not have elevated him to such a high position within their church.
Obviously he was as good a Christian as anyone else in his congregation. Maybe better.
30
posted on
06/01/2009 8:07:50 PM PDT
by
P-Marlowe
(LPFOKETT GAHCOEEP-w/o*)
To: Conservativegreatgrandma
The LCMS is partly responsible for that. Are you familiar with Seminex? Basically, the MO synod purged out some liberal members in the 70s. There are a lot of hard feelings and it's difficult to get to the truth about what happened. I read a book written by one of the guys who got purged, and it made him look bad; worse than what the issues were at the time. Eventually they merged with other Lutherans forming ELCA.
31
posted on
06/02/2009 6:59:45 AM PDT
by
In veno, veritas
(Please identify my Ad Hominem attacks. I should be debating ideas.)
To: bdeaner
Please be honest. You know as well as I there are plenty of proabortion priests in the Catholic church. The Catholic church is permeated with high profile pro-life politicians and they turn a blind eye.
There are even pro-choice groups within the Catholic Church. Catholics voted 55% for Obama so dont pretend the Catholic Church is a pure church--it is not.
To: vpintheak
I might point out that the Lutheran Church Missouri Synod excommunicated Tiller so not all Lutheran churches accept abortion.
To: In veno, veritas
I've heard about Seminex but we were ALC at the time so was not even aware of it then. It sounds like those who got together to form the ELCA all deserved each other.
Good for the LCMS again.
It was strange. I grew up in a small German town with the ALC and there was a LCMS church in a neighboring town but there was always a prejudice against the LCMS. I never knew what it was but it was there. I believe it is still there and that is why those at the ELCA church will not leave and go to the neighboring LCMS.
The members of the ELCA congregation do not know the blessings that are waiting for them.
To: In veno, veritas
I have a current LCMS friend who can explain the whole thing and I need to sit down with her again and let her explain it to me.
To: Conservativegreatgrandma
There is some prejudice the other way, too. Mainly because of things like abortion and homosexuality even though there may be some very conservative churches. But I would also fault the some LCMS churches, too; I've heard of a couple living together unmarried but it doesn't get confronted. Usually something public like that should warrant excommunication.
36
posted on
06/02/2009 7:47:17 AM PDT
by
In veno, veritas
(Please identify my Ad Hominem attacks. I should be debating ideas.)
To: P-Marlowe
You should use a sarcasm tag. Someone might think you’re serious.
37
posted on
06/02/2009 7:48:31 AM PDT
by
MEGoody
(Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
To: Conservativegreatgrandma
Please be honest. You know as well as I there are plenty of proabortion priests in the Catholic church. The Catholic church is permeated with high profile pro-life politicians and they turn a blind eye. There are even pro-choice groups within the Catholic Church. Catholics voted 55% for Obama so dont pretend the Catholic Church is a pure church--it is not.
I will explain, not to cause strife, but to express my understanding and to clarify misunderstanding, in Christ's name, with, God willing, the guidance of the Holy Spirit. We are all brothers and sisters in Christ, first and foremost. Let us not lose sight of that.
It is important to understand the difference between priests and members of the Church and the Magisterium of the Church (The Cardinals, the Pope, and the Deposit of Faith in Scripture and Tradition).
There are fallen, heretical members of the Church, including priests and even bishops. The Church has as many sinners as there are members. But the Magisterium -- the Truth that is preserved and protected by the Church (according to Christ's promise to Peter) -- has always been pro-life and always will be pro-life. That is as certain a truth as "2 + 2 = 4."
See for example 1 Timothy 3:15, where the Church is called "the pillar and ground of truth." It is this Church which received Christ's promise that the gates of Hell would not prevail against it (Matt. 16:18), that He would always be with it (Matt. 28:20), and that He would give it the Holy Spirit to teach it all truth (John 16:13).
To the visible head of the Church, St. Peter, Our Lord said: "And I will give to thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven. And whatsoever thou shalt bind upon earth, it shall be bound also in heaven: and, whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth, it shall be loosed also in heaven." (Matt. 16:19).
I mention these passages, again, because they show how Our Lord emphasized the authority of His Church and the role it would have in safeguarding and defining the Deposit of Faith. The pro-life ethic is preserved and safeguarded in that Deposit of Faith.
I respect that we are Brothers in Christ and have more in common than our differences, and do not mean any disrespect. Obviously, I believe strongly in my Church or I would not belong to it.
I would die for these beliefs and my Church. Would you die for yours?
(note: this should not be construed as a threat, just as a peaceful testimony to the strength and depth of my Faith!).
38
posted on
06/02/2009 8:05:09 AM PDT
by
bdeaner
(The bread which we break, is it not a participation in the body of Christ? (1 Cor. 10:16))
To: Conservativegreatgrandma
You betcha. I used to be WELS, I know there is no way that evil man could have ever been a member. The difference is repenting, and not. Tiller was an unrepentant murderer. His murder was dispicable as all murders are and I mourn for his family.
39
posted on
06/02/2009 9:10:35 AM PDT
by
vpintheak
(Like a muddied spring or a polluted well is a righteous man who gives way to the wicked. Prov. 25:26)
To: In veno, veritas
Absolutely, you are totally correct but I wasn’t referring to anything like that. When we were young these things were not issues at all. There was no substantive reason for the prejudice—it was just there and I’m sure the LCMS church people felt the same way about the ALC people but they didn’t know why.
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