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To: mrsalty

Origen of Alexandria, in a passage that was later chosen by Gregory of Nazianzus for inclusion in the Philocalia, an anthology of some of his most important texts, made the following very modern-sounding remarks:

“For who that has understanding will sup­pose that the first, and second, and third day, and the evening and the morning, ex­isted without a sun, and moon, and stars? And that the first day was, as it were, also without a sky? And who is so foolish as to suppose that God, after the manner of a husbandman, planted a paradise in Eden, towards the east, and placed in it a tree of life, visible and palpable, so that one tasting of the fruit by the bodily teeth obtained life? And again, that one was a partaker of good and evil by masticating what was taken from the tree? And if God is said to walk in the paradise in the evening, and Adam to hide himself under a tree, I do not suppose that anyone doubts that these things figuratively indi­cate certain mysteries, the history having taken place in appearance, and not literally.” (De Principiis IV, 3, 1 [6])


85 posted on 03/25/2009 11:00:08 PM PDT by campaignPete R-CT
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To: campaignPete R-CT

I believe what I believe, and that makes me what I am!! Ive never even heard of the writers you posted or heard their names, but I believe what the Bible says, not what a human says!


86 posted on 03/25/2009 11:09:33 PM PDT by mrsalty
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To: campaignPete R-CT
"“For who that has understanding will sup­pose that the first, and second, and third day, and the evening and the morning, ex­isted without a sun, and moon, and stars? And that the first day was, as it were, also without a sky?""

Why not? A day is measured as one rotation of the earth in relation to a fixed point of light,what's wrong with assuming that He who said "let there be light" was the source of that light?

"...and placed in it a tree of life, visible and palpable, so that one tasting of the fruit by the bodily teeth obtained life?"

"Obtained life"? They already had life and were told they would lose it if they ate of the tree.

"And again, that one was a partaker of good and evil by masticating what was taken from the tree?"

Maybe it had less to do with masticating than it did with disobeying God.

"And if God is said to walk in the paradise in the evening, and Adam to hide himself under a tree..."

So what? God can't walk in the garden? Adam can't make a feeble attempt at hiding himself from God because he knew he had disobeyed Him?

"I do not suppose that anyone doubts that these things figuratively indi­cate certain mysteries..."

True enough however it doesn't automatically mean the events didn't also litterally happen.

"the history having taken place in appearance, and not literally"

Nothing said here convinces me in the slightest I should not take Genesis as I read it.

We have no idea how much worldy 'stuff' seeps into us from the day we are born.But the more we begin to grasp what is actually happening the easier it is to believe the Word of God.

100 posted on 03/26/2009 12:14:10 AM PDT by mitch5501 (Yeah,but is it shatterproof?)
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To: campaignPete R-CT
Origen of Alexandria<.I>

Origen, the Neoplatonist was well known (even more so today with the better vision of perspective and history) as a radical in that he took pretty much NONE of the Bible as literal - instead he allegorized everything to mean something quite different from what was both accepted at the time, and what was clearly on the pages of scripture. Yes, this is the same Origen who denied Christ's physical resurrection. But I would imagine this ties in directly with his theology based on allegory of the Bible (rationalism based on platonistic practice).

106 posted on 03/26/2009 12:37:50 AM PDT by TheBattman (Pray for our country....)
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