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To: topcat54
Actually, it doesn't say that at all. Some people interpret the phrase “until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in” to be a reference to the millennium or some such era, but the text does not plainly or literally say that. Some people interpret this to speak of some time in the future, but, again, that is purely an interpretation based partly on some preconceived ideas of what ought to happen to Jews in the future.

OK, I'll play...What then does it mean???

Rom 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel,

What's that mean??? Blindness in part has come to Israel...

until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in.

Until obviously means future...Did it happen??? When??? Will it happen??? Or does it mean something else entirely???

There is a lot of symbolic language that some folks falsely interpret literally to refer to Jesus reigning in body on the earth. Problem is there is absolutely nothing in the NT to support that idea. Jesus and His apostles were not literalists, in the modern sense. They interpreted most of the OT prophecies about Messiah symbolically to refer to the present reign of Christ over the nations. Cf. 1 Cor. 15:23-25.

1Co 15:21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.
1Co 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
1Co 15:23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

Is this symbolic??? Or did Jesus show up like you guys claim in 70 A.D.??? And did all dead folks come alive at that time???

1Co 15:24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power. 1Co 15:25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.

According to this, the Kingdom doesn't get delivered until Jesus puts down all rule, power and authority...And put ALL His enemies under his feet...So what's up with all this stuff??? And what about blinding Israel, and the fullness of the Gentiles???

225 posted on 03/02/2009 6:08:46 AM PST by Iscool (I don't understand all that I know...)
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To: Iscool
OK, I'll play...What then does it mean???

It could mean any number of things depending on whether or not you interpret it in the light of the rest of Scripture. I’ll just point out that there is nothing about the millennium in the passage. There is nothing about a distinct period of time after “until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in”. In fact it is not even clear from the passage that the phrase “until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in” is intended to denote a period of time as opposed to, say, some condition then present within the covenant community. It’s impossible to interpret the phrase “all Israel” without reference to Paul’s earlier arguments (cf. Rom. 9:6,7).

The point of my comment was to show how your earlier claim of not interpreting but rather just plainly reading the text is simply not the case.

226 posted on 03/02/2009 6:41:50 AM PST by topcat54
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To: Iscool
1Co 15:23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming. 1Co 15:24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power. 1Co 15:25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.

The text is quite plain. Christ first (aka “the first resurrection”, that, we know is past), and those who are Christ’s at His coming (Second coming that is, not “rapture”), and then “the end” when the kingdom is delivered up to the Father. At this point all rule and authority has been put in subjection to the Son. “For He must reign” – in Paul’s mind this was a present, not future reality. Christ is reigning and subduing the nations (Rom. 15:11,12). That’s the point of the passage. Cf. Matt. 28:18ff, “All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth”.

Most futurists want to insert between 1000 and 1007 years somewhere into that passage, in spite of the fact that the apostle Paul knows of no such chronology. Now, you tell me whether that is the true reading of the passage, or a forced interpretation based on preconceived ideas of the millennium.

230 posted on 03/02/2009 7:26:17 AM PST by topcat54
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