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To: cothrige
I just read where one of the men will give Mass for the pope and I was silly enough to believe it would be in a church sanctioned by the Church under approval of the man that just let him back in.

It is true the man could be giving the Mass in a garage in front of atheists and not sanctioned by the Church. The SSPX had their own buildings and were the honcho's of their own sect. Are they back in, or still out? I assumed they were back in the fold. Silly me.

If they can't influence the flock to error, then I'm perfectly OK.

157 posted on 01/30/2009 8:35:24 PM PST by chuckles
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To: chuckles
I am having a hard time telling how much of your post is sarcastic, and how much isn't. But I will try.
I just read where one of the men will give Mass for the pope and I was silly enough to believe it would be in a church sanctioned by the Church under approval of the man that just let him back in.

Nobody let anyone "back in." That term is not really applicable here, as it is too fuzzy. The Church views anyone of faith in Christ as "in" in some way. The communion one person may have with the Church can be almost nonexistant or full, and anywhere in between. The SSPX are Catholic, most certainly, but their relationship to the Church is not complete. It can be described as anything from schismatic to imperfect, and you will get various responses depending upon whom you ask and what you have in mind. But, they are certainly not regularized. Their relationship to the Church is most certainly not full communion, and their Masses are absolutely illicit. Their priests are acting without faculties from Rome.

As to the Mass offered for the Pope, I am quite confident that the Holy Father accepts such with humility. Consider that Protestants are not "in" the Church in the way you seem to be implying, and yet if such were to offer prayers for any Catholic I am sure that person would welcome that. Who would reject prayers from Christians?

It is true the man could be giving the Mass in a garage in front of atheists and not sanctioned by the Church.

Yes, he could, but he isn't. People in SSPX chapels and churches are hardly atheists, and the chapels themselves are certainly not "garages." But, neither are they "sanctioned."

The SSPX had their own buildings and were the honcho's of their own sect. Are they back in, or still out? I assumed they were back in the fold. Silly me.

Yes, silly you. Why do people think they can read a report about an internal and very specific juridical action by the Pope and while not having any real idea at all or working knowledge of any kind about what is going on they assume that they can still speak with authority about the subject? If you are ignorant regarding what excommunications are, why they are issued, and how they are lifted, and what all of it means regarding other issues, then you should hardly be surprised that you don't know what affect it has on the people involved. The SSPX bishops were excommunicated, and they were separated from full communion with the Church. One of those has changed. The other has not.

If they can't influence the flock to error, then I'm perfectly OK.

I can't see why you would care. What you call error is surely a great deal of what we call revealed truth. However, accepting that, I would think that the SSPX are as capable of influencing people into errors as any other group out there. That is why the excommunications have been lifted. Right now the SSPX must be dialogued with like many other groups, such as Jews or Protestants. If the organization will eventually submit to Rome and return to the fold fully then the Pope will again be able to exercise his authority directly with them and that means he would be able to discipline such silliness as has been happening lately. Right now he can do nothing really, since they only accept him nominally. They were already exommunicated after all, and that didn't stop them from being morons, but they were still drawing tradition loving Catholics from the fold. They need to return to a proper relationship with Rome, and they would not consider that until the exommunications were lifted. It is simple, and this is step one to fixing things.

168 posted on 01/31/2009 11:23:18 AM PST by cothrige (Ego vero Evangelio non crederem, ni si me catholicae Ecclesiae commoveret auctoritas.)
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