***The Bible is the product of the Church; the Church is not the product of the Bible; the Church is the product of Christ. Hardly a secular book, unless your understanding of secular approaches your apparent understanding of Christ.
Craaaaazy, man...The bible you are referring is your religion’s Catholic verion put together hundreds of years after the scriptures were in circulation saving people left and right...***
Where are your Gospel of Judas and your Epistle of Barnabas? Scripture was chosen by the institution of Christ. Where are your Acts of Peter and Paul? There are dozens of writings that were circulating.
How do Scriptures save people? They don’t. Your Church of Iscool (population 1) has some work to do.
***The Bible is the product of the Church
This goes along with your fallacy that the church is your pope, cardinals, bishops and priests...***
Prove it wrong.
***Jesus is the WORD...And Jesus gave us the ‘word’ that we would hear it, get saved and become members of His church...
The church started as a result of the spoken word as well as the written word of OT prophecies...The spoken portion of the word became the written word so the apostles and disciples could pass on accurately that which they were taught...
There was no such thing as the ‘church’ being a wayword institution until your religion could straighten it out with it’s own version of scripture...***
For once you have it sort of right. The Church was the Institution that Jesus created and the Holy Spirit commissioned at Pentecost. It took over 300 years to create the New Testament and ensure that this was the literature of the Church.
If you think that the NT was God’s dictated word, you should read the first verses of Luke and Acts which specifically say that it is not.
Rom 10:14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?
Rom 10:15 And how shall they preach, except they be sent?
as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!
Rom 10:16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?
Rom 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
Do you know what the word of God is??? I'll give you a hint...It is NOT your church...And it is not your church tradition...Still don't get it???
The word of God is the scriptures...
Joh 5:39 Search the Scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.
Did Jesus say to search the Catholic church??? Did Jesus say to search the Catholic tradition??? No??? He must have made a mistake, eh???
Me This goes along with your fallacy that the church is your pope, cardinals, bishops and priests...
You Prove it wrong.
My pleasure...
Act 8:3 As for Saul, he made havoc of the church, entering into every house, and haling men and women committed them to prison.
Act 11:26 And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch.
They were assembled with the called out assembly, the church...They were NOT the church...
Act 15:4 And when they were come to Jerusalem, they were received of the church, and of the apostles and elders, and they declared all things that God had done with them.
You will notice here and most other places the apostles and elders are NOT the church
They were received of the church, AND the apostles and elders...It's not a buiding...It's not a priesthood...It's the called out assembly of believers...
Act 15:22 Then pleased it the apostles and elders, with the whole church, to send chosen men of their own company to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas: namely, Judas surnamed Barsabas, and Silas, chief men among the brethren:
With the whole church...
Act 20:17 And from Miletus he sent to Ephesus, and called the elders of the church.
NOT the elders, the church...The elders OF the church...
Act 20:28 Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.
The apostles are told to feed the church which is the flock, NOT each other...
Rom 16:5 Likewise greet the church that is in their house. Salute my well-beloved Epaenetus, who is the firstfruits of Achaia unto Christ.
What??? No cathedral??? The churches are in houses...
1Co 1:2 Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both theirs and ours:
This one is so explanatory that you couldn't miss it with the Hubble telescope...
This is just a small sampling of the scriptures that prove you pope, cardinals, bishops and priests are NOT the church...
Where are your Gospel of Judas and your Epistle of Barnabas? Scripture was chosen by the institution of Christ. Where are your Acts of Peter and Paul? There are dozens of writings that were circulating.
When were these things written??? Who wrote them??? Does your church or anyone have the original manuscripts of these tales??? What language were they written in???
For once you have it sort of right.
When it comes to scripture, I don't think you're the guy to tell me or anyone who is right or not right...
It took over 300 years to create the New Testament and ensure that this was the literature of the Church.
Oh come now...You think Jesus had to wait 300 years for you guys to figure out which scriptures Jesus said he would preserve forever??? If Jesus didn't have it all wrapped up with the last writing of the last apostle, He ain't much of a God, is He???