Posted on 01/18/2009 8:59:21 PM PST by Marechal
You've made a good point, but the website makes the point that the New Testament has lines in it that explicitly state that prayer is always answered.
You've hit upon an argument I often make when someone tries to posit a creator God: Even if one existed, what evidence is there that this being still exists, or even knows or cares about what we want? If a deity or an alien civilization created all we observe here on Earth, then left, it would be the same as far as trying to interact with either one.
No intrusion, this discussion is open to all FReepers.
I was looking for some guidance on this in the Federalist Papers, but being as the First Amendment was adopted after the Constitution was drawn up, I was unable to find anything regarding the intent of the Founding Fathers as to what they thought the First Amendment was supposed to mean exactly. Perhaps another person reading this could shed some light on the subject.
Regardless of the meaning of "respecting an establishment of religion" was two hundred years ago, it has come to be a mixed bag of things. We do not fund explicitly religious activites with tax dollars, but we do not tax churches as businesses, or even tax the property directly connected with their religious activities. That compromise seems to be acceptable to most Americans.
I'll admit some atheists don't necessarily feel that way, and they have the right to lobby their representatives for their position. I don't share it.
OK, I have to nit pick: Answering prayer and granting requests are two different things. I must presume you meant the latter.
You have hit upon a bone of contention I have with some of my fellow Christians in the discussion of this very article. If you will examine some of my other posts, you may note I make a New Testament based argument against the presumption that God always grants a request for healing even from a believer who has faith. I believe the argument applies to other kinds of requests as well.
what evidence is there that this being still exists
There are tons of reports and testimonies of such evidence. You may choose to dismiss them based on the philosophical assumption of naturalism, but to do so you must conclude that every last one of such myriad reports are are either mistaken or dishonest. In short, you must ignore evidence that doesn't support your assumptions.
If a deity or an alien civilization created all we observe here on Earth, then left, it would be the same as far as trying to interact with either one.
We need to consider the theological/philosophical concept of transcendence here. The stuff of nature follows the laws of nature. Among the most obvious laws of nature is that stuff does not just come from nothing. Thus any such creator or creators must be outside the laws of nature. That precludes space alien cultures at the least.
Let me flesh this out a little:
Something can not exist in nature, except by being a subsequent state of its former self...that is simply the way nature operates. All the stuff is just the latest version of the stuff it used to be (matter or energy, whichever). If nature was it, than there would be no way for nature to start, nor for it to have always existed.
Thus something able to start nature, or something able to cause nature to always have existed, must exist. And it must be outside the bounds of nature, or the same problem would apply to it.
Thus any creator must transcend the laws of nature.
It makes sense that such a transcendent thing would be outside and beyond time and eternal, so asking whether or not it still exists doesn't make much sense.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.