Life On Gold Plates - (LDS) Open

http://lifeongoldplates.blogspot.com/2008/08/bushmans-introduction-to-joseph-smith.html ^ | August 14, 2008 | Richard Bushman

[svcw]

You mean like this:
Tennis Shoes Among the Nephites, Iron Rod key chains, Captain Moroni action figures, Seven Habits of Highly Effective Poorly Written Books… All priestcraft.

[DanielLongo]

I said "accusation". Who was "accused"? What was "accused"?

Did you have lunch yet?

[greyfoxx39]

Obviously, you are reading something into this that the rest of us are not.

I see you haven't been around much in the past few months...perhaps you missed all the changes in the Religion Forum rules?

Open threads are a town square. Antagonism though not encouraged, should be expected

Posters may argue for or against beliefs of any kind. They may tear down other’s beliefs. They may ridicule.

On all threads, but particularly “open” threads, posters must never “make it personal.” Reading minds and attributing motives are forms of “making it personal.” Making a thread “about” another Freeper is “making it personal.”

When in doubt, review your use of the pronoun “you” before hitting “enter.”

Like the Smoky Backroom, the conversation may be offensive to some.

Thin-skinned posters will be booted from “open” threads because in the town square, they are the disrupters.

 

Link

[restornu]

Retrieved from “http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Praise_to_the_Man";

has now become “the very real, fallible, human being”.

Side note: The “mormon web-cleaner” has been at work on this hymn. It’s not as easy to find as it was a short time ago. I have it archived now.

*****

Same words are in my hymnal!

http://www.lds.org/churchmusic/detailmusicPlayer/index.html?searchlanguage=1&searchcollection=1&searchseqstart=27&searchsubseqstart=%20&searchseqend=27&searchsubseqend=ZZZ

[DanielLongo]

I just cited two Evangelical pamphlets targeting “Mormonism”. It’s now your turn to produce materials from the Church that target your church or any other church.
The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints is the standard of Christianity. It has never spoken against Christianity. How absurd.

[DanielLongo]

My Savior and Redeemer. The very Son of the Living God.

[DanielLongo]

Are you saying you belong to the church of the devil? That could explain alot.

[restornu]

When one is coming up empty mocking won’t work either....

[DanielLongo]

I assume you have some evidence to refute this research?

[restornu]

...now bitterness is starting to surface

[DanielLongo]

Ok (sigh) what problem do you have with this hymn specifically. I already know how you feel about it. Anything scripturally in error to your eyes?

[greyfoxx39]

The Pet Shop Skit...
Again and again and again...

Sighhhhh.....! I think that all the "renewed" apologists ought to be directed to read

This whole thread

when they pop up and start with all the same arguments we've dealt with time and again.

[greyfoxx39]

There used to be a whole lot more sites with those lyrics on them....many have “disappeared”.

[Zakeet]

"a respected LDS source" ... He is an academic. There are people not of our faith who teach at BYU who hold chairs in certain studies. This does not give their opinions any more weight than any member of the Church or nonmember.

Richard L. Bushman is indeed well respected ...

According to This Source:

• Dr. Bushman is a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. He has served as a missionary in New England and Atlantic Canada, and has held various lay positions within the Mormon Church, including Seminary teacher, bishop, stake president, and Stake Patriarch.

• Dr. Bushman received his AB, AM, and PhD degrees from Harvard University.

• Dr. Bushman taught at Harvard, Brigham Young University, Boston University, and the University of Delaware before joining the history faculty at Columbia.

• Dr. Bushman is the Gouverneur Morris Professor of History emeritus at Columbia University and was appointed to a professorship in Mormon studies at Claremont Graduate University and will begin in that position in fall 2008 -- a chair which was funded by Mormon Contributions and named in honor of a Mormon Church President.

• Dr. Bushman's scholarship includes studies of early American social, cultural, and political history, American religious history, and the history of the Mormon Church.

• Dr. Bushman's books have won numerous awards. In 1968, Bushman's From Puritan to Yankee: Character and Social Order in Connecticut, 1690-1765 won the prestigious Bancroft Prize, an award given by the trustees of Columbia University for the year's best book on American history. Bushman has also received the Phi Alpha Theta prize, and Evans Biography Awards, administered by the Mountain West Center for Regional Studies at Utah State University.

• Dr. Bushman received the Mormon History Association's annual 2006 Best Book award for his biography Joseph Smith: Rough Stone Rolling -- which is so balanced it is currently on sale at both Deseret Books (along with several other books written by him) and Utah Lighthouse Ministries.

• Dr. Bushman has held Guggenheim, Huntington, National Humanities Center, and National Endowment for Humanities fellowships.

• Dr. Bushman served as president of the Mormon History Association (1985–1986).

• Dr. Bushman serves as one of three general editors of the forthcoming Joseph Smith Papers.

As noted by one of your fellow LDS believers on this thread here, Dr. Bushman is in great demand as a speaker in LDS sponsored events.

... and Dr. Bushman's opinions carry a lot of weight!

---

I hardly see any reason for your apparent glee.

I'm not sure what you're talking about.

I have posted two other comments on this thread.

1. The first comment, located here, merely summarized the conclusions reached by Dr. Bushman in the original article.

2. The second comment, located here, took the position Dr. Bushman will not be reprimanded, perhaps disfellowshipped by the Mormon Church, and that his lectures are part of efforts by the Church to deal with the issue members who discover the historical facts about Joseph Smith via. the Internet.

How do either of those comments constitute expressing glee?

[restornu]

Obviously, [you are reading something into this](?) that the rest of us are not.

I would think you would welcome questions on the OPEN forum!:)

[DanielLongo]

This is actually a really good hymn to cite relative to the article this post is base on. It was written by WW Phelps who had become disaffected from the Prophet and the Church later to return. His sentiments, shared by many, are the result of his abiding love for the man and his testimony of the truthfulness of the work the Lord did through him.

A tender story from Church history illustrates the power of a forgiving heart. William W. Phelps joined the Church during the Kirtland era and became a devoted follower of the Prophet Joseph Smith. He was called to be a member of the stake presidency in Jackson County, Missouri. Later, as a result of some financial improprieties and an unrepentant heart, Brother Phelps left the Church. He became bitter and declared himself an enemy to the Prophet. His defection occurred during a time of intense persecution when the Prophet, along with many of the leading brethren, had been arrested and placed under military guard following the “extermination order” of Governor Lilburn W. Boggs of Missouri.

The Prophet’s life hung literally in the balance. In the midst of such turmoil, William W. Phelps came forth to serve as a state witness against the Prophet. Compounding his betrayal, Phelps also signed a certificate defending the actions of one of the Saints’ worst enemies.

As a result of such testimony from Phelps and others like him, the Prophet and several of the brethren were incarcerated in a series of Missouri prisons, including Liberty Jail, until April 1839, when they escaped and fled to Illinois. We can perhaps imagine the bitter disappointment the Prophet endured during the months of his imprisonment as he contemplated the betrayal of brethren he had loved and trusted.

Two years later, after great anguish and bitter remorse for his actions, Brother Phelps sent the Prophet a heartfelt letter that began:

“Brother Joseph, … I am as the prodigal son. … I have seen the folly of my way, and I tremble at the gulf I have passed.” He begged the forgiveness of the brethren and asked that even with severe chastisement he might return to them. 4

The Prophet’s almost immediate reply stands today as a worthy example of the power of forgiveness and of the great heart of the man Joseph Smith:

“Dear Brother Phelps: …

“You may in some measure realize what my feelings, as well as Elder Rigdon’s and Brother Hyrum’s were, when we read your letter—truly our hearts were melted into tenderness and compassion when we ascertained your resolves. …

“It is true, that we have suffered much in consequence of your behavior—the cup of gall, already full enough for mortals to drink, was indeed filled to overflowing when you turned against us. …

“However, the cup has been drunk, the will of our Father has been done, and we are yet alive, for which we thank the Lord. And having been delivered from the hands of wicked men by the mercy of our God, we say it is your privilege to be delivered from the powers of the adversary, be brought into the liberty of God’s dear children, and again take your stand among the Saints of the Most High, and by diligence, humility, and love unfeigned, commend yourself to our God, and your God, and to the Church of Jesus Christ.

“Believing your confession to be real, and your repentance genuine, I shall be happy once again to give you the right hand of fellowship, and rejoice over the returning prodigal. …

‘Come on, dear brother, since the war is past,

‘For friends at first, are friends again at last.’

“Yours as ever,

“Joseph Smith, Jun.” 5

[Utah Binger]

Experts everywhere we look. Injuns ain’t entitled to them names...WE took it over and we’s the EXPERTS. Besides, them Lamenites ain’t a white and delightsum folk; no sir they ain’t.

Plus, I got me a wiki google to look it all up and talk over you, cus that makes me an expert! I can cut and paste till the cows come home!

[svcw]

You are joking right?
Every post (closed I might add) is an attack again Christianity.
I laugh at your a assertion that ldsers never attack Christians.

[DanielLongo]

Ldsers have never bashed Christians - oh way funny

Those of us from Missouri like to say, "show me".

Show me.

[svcw]

Good answer but thats not it.
By the way do you mean a son of god or The Son of God?