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To: John Leland 1789
And my point is, NOT ONE SINGLE organization on earth today professing to be a Christian church teaches anybody to observe ALL things whatsoever Christ commanded

I thought you point to me was that the Church has not been commissioned to forgive sins. Now we have it settled that she has been, do we not?

I still don't see any "curtain" between the Grand Commission and any other commandment of the gospel.

If the Catholic Chuirch is not doing something she should, please let me know what it is, and I'll let the Holy Father know of such a scandal. Other "churches" in your post aren't.

1,030 posted on 08/09/2008 10:07:16 PM PDT by annalex (http://www.catecheticsonline.com/CatenaAurea.php)
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To: annalex
No, we don't agree. There is no Scripture that speaks of any church forgiving sins.

And you do not agree that “all commandments” (Matthew 28:20) refers to “ALL” commandments as per the verse.

It seems you want to avoid the truth that the Apostles were given a specific ministry in the Book of Matthew to the “lost sheep of the children of Israel,” but there it is in black and white (Matthew 10:5). It seems you want to avoid the truth that Matthew 10 contains COMMANDMENTS to the Apostles and others. These commandments would be included in the “all commandments” of Matthew 28:20. Trinitarian baptism is only one of many of the commandments that the Lord issued to His Apostles during His earthly ministry.

But to admit that the Apostles were bound to teach others to observe ALL (including the commandments of Matthew 10) would establish an Israeli/Jewish context, and it seems that you don't want that to be established.

But that's ok. Because others who are reading these many posts are getting the point about the “ALL commandments” of Matthew chapter 28 including “ALL” of the commandments in the entire Book of Matthew, from the time of His calling the Apostles being included. Many others reading these do see that you cannot restrict the instruction in Matthew 28:20 only to 28:19, 20.

Thus, the context is established for the Apostles ministry to Israel. The first seven chapters of the Book of Acts, therefore carries on this theme of preaching to Israel only, and preaching repentance and forgiveness specifically to Israel. And here are two key verses that specify that nation.

Ac 5:31 — “Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance TO ISRAEL, and forgiveness of sins.”

Nothing had changed from John the Baptist's ministry.

Ac 13:24 — “When John had first preached before his coming the baptism of repentance to all the people of Israel.”

And thus:

“there were dwelling at Jerusalem JEWS (not Christians or the Body of Christ), devout men, out of every nation under heaven.” (Acts 2:5)

“But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, YE MEN OF JUDEA, and all YE THAT DWELL AT JERUSALEM (not Christians or the Body of Christ), be this known unto you, . . . “ (Acts 2:14)

“YE MEN OF ISRAEL (not the church), hear these words; . . . . “

“YE (Israel, not the church) have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain: . . . “ (Acts 2:23)

“MEN AND BRETHREN (he wasn't addressing Christians, but his ISRAELI brethren), let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, . . . “ (Acts 2:29)

“Therefore let all THE HOUSE OF ISRAEL (not the Body of Christ) know assuredly,” (Acts 2:29)

“Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, MEN AND BRETHREN, what shall we do?” Now the Israelites refer to Peter and the apostles as “BRETHREN” because they were all associated as Israelites (not associated as Christians - the speakers in v. 37 were not Christians)

“Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.” (Acts 2:38).

The Apostles, speaking to ALL Israelites, commanded them to be repent and be baptized for the remission of sins. And there it is. The Apostles had the authority to remit the national sins of Israel which are detailed in the same chapter. John had come baptizing (by immersion in a river, not by sprinkling or dampening). And the gift of the Holy Spirit was promised to the nation upon their repentance - an Old Testament feature put forth by the prophets to Israel (not to the church) hundreds of years previously.

“And when Peter saw it, he answered unto the people, YE MEN OF ISRAEL, why marvel ye at this? or why look ye so earnestly on us, as though by our own power or holiness we had made this man to walk?” (3:12)

“But ye denied the Holy One and the Just, and desired a murderer to be granted unto you; And killed the Prince of life, whom God hath raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses.” (Acts 3:14, 15) Again, the audience is Israel, not the Body of Christ. In fact, up to this point we don't read of one address to the Gentiles or the Body of Christ. Peter didn't know anything about the Body of Christ yet.

Still preaching to Israel (not the Body of Christ), Peter continues . . .

“Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord; And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:” (Acts 3:19, 20)

There it is, “blotting out of sins” — Israel's national sins. And there is also the promise that upon Israel's repentance, Christ will be sent back.

“Ye are the CHILDREN OF THE PROPHETS, and of the covenant which God made with our fathers, saying unto Abraham, And in thy seed shall all the kindreds of the earth be blessed.” Further establishing the context to be an Israeli/Jewish one.

“Then Peter, filled with the Holy Ghost, said unto them, YE RULERS OF THE PEOPLE AND ELDERS OF ISRAEL, . . . “ (Acts 5:8)

It just goes from one address to Israel to another address to Israel. Now five chapters in to the Book of Acts and there is still not a single sermon preached to the Body of Christ. There is no revelation of the Body of Christ yet, even to the Apostles.

And the solidly Jewish context goes all the way through Acts chapter 7.

There is a “Church” there to be sure. It is a “called out assembly” of Israelites who have repented as commanded, had their sins remitted, were baptized (Just as John the Baptist had baptized Israelites, and just as the “church in the wilderness {Israel - Acts 7:38}), and awaiting the coming of their Messiah (Acts 3:21).

No trinitarian Baptism is performed or even discussed in these chapters in Acts, or anywhere in the Book of Acts, for that matter.

1,039 posted on 08/10/2008 3:41:35 AM PDT by John Leland 1789
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