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To: CharlesWayneCT
And considering that pagans referred to various female goddesses such as Ishtar, Ashtaroth, etc, as "Queen of Heaven", you can see where the pagan influence crept into early Christianity from the various pagans converting and coming into the church but not quite wanting to leave their old beliefs behind.

It's not that I don't respect and honor Mary as the Mother of God, it's simply that the church has built up an entire, massive doctrine around her that can be clearly seen to have arisen from an early pagan influence, and that is unnecessary and a distraction. I don't need an "intercessor", nor does anyone else - we have an intercessor - the "man Christ Jesus". He is the one and only mediator between man and God, and the only one necessary and the only one we should be directing our prayers to, outside the Father and Holy Spirit.

Catholics use a disingenuous argument when they claim that we can ask saints and Mary to pray for us just like we ask our friends to pray for us. Our friends are clearly living, and can clearly hear our request. There is no evidence that those who have died and gone to be in the presence of the Lord can at all hear anyone on earth.

Even if they could, how could they conceivably handle billions of "intercession" requests since they do not possess the attribute of omnipresence. This "omnipresence" aspect of the dilemma is one in which I have heard Catholics give simply tortured answers to, in attempts to skirt or divert the logic of the situation. And I do mean tortured logic.

There is no argument possible for the "intercession" of Mary and saints, hearing the prayers of billions of believers, that can in any way dodge the issue of "omnipresence". None. And once you pin it to this issue, it all goes up in smoke. But like I said, I have heard some tortured and circular logic to try to get around it. It doesn't wash.

292 posted on 06/01/2008 9:22:58 AM PDT by Boagenes (I'm your huckleberry, that's just my game.)
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To: Boagenes
And once you pin it to this issue, it all goes up in smoke.

LOL

293 posted on 06/01/2008 9:25:30 AM PDT by Petronski (Scripture & Tradition must be accepted & honored w/equal sentiments of devotion & reverence. CCC 82)
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