Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

To: Dr. Eckleburg
"But since in Adam all are sinners, deserving of eternal death, it is obvious that nothing but sin will be found in men. Therefore, God’s foreknowledge cannot be the reason of our election, because when God [looks into the future and] surveys all mankind, he will find them all, from the first to the last, under the same curse. So we see how foolishly triflers prattle when they ascribe to mere naked foreknowledge what must be founded on God’s good pleasure..."

Doctor, could you please explain why the above statement from your page should be accepted as truth? Is it from the bible? Is it not true that since time is an invention of man that there is no time in God?

10,665 posted on 06/30/2008 8:43:05 PM PDT by oneolcop
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10625 | View Replies ]


To: oneolcop

Don’t expect an answer.


10,668 posted on 06/30/2008 9:27:42 PM PDT by Judith Anne
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10665 | View Replies ]

To: oneolcop; blue-duncan
Men often wave off God's predestination with the flick of the "time is irrelevant" wrist.

All we know is what God tells us of Himself and the world. He tells us that all men are fallen, and none seek Him unless He first drags them to Him by the gift of the indwelling Holy Spirit.

He tells us He has graced with faith those whom He has loved from before the foundation of the world, before they could do anything good or evil, so that election depends on His mercy alone, and not on men's willing or running.

What we do know of "time," according to God's revealed will in Scripture, is that men are regenerated first by God in order that they believe and be saved. Men do not regenerate themselves. It is a supernatural act of God, given as a free gift of mercy, and not debt.

You referenced my homepage where we see Paul's take on his own abilities...

"But by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me." -- 1 Corinthians 15:10

Since you quoted Calvin, let's read the entire quote where we find Scriptural evidence of his opinion...

Calvin's Commentary on Malachi

"...As we have said, there is no real difference among men, except in their hidden election. Some theologians would make foreknowledge the mother of election, and that very foolishly and childishly. They say that some men are chosen and others rejected by God, because God, from whom nothing is hidden, foresees of what sort each man will be. But I ask, Whence comes virtue to one and vice to the other? If they say, "From free will," surely creation was before free will. This is one point. Besides, we know that all men were created alike in the person of Adam. . . .

And what does this mean except that the condition of all who come from the one root is the same? I am not discussing "special gifts." I admit that if our nature had not been corrupted and we all had the same assurance of blessedness, we would be endowed with a variety of gifts. . . . But since in Adam all are sinners, deserving of eternal death, it is obvious that nothing but sin will be found in men. Therefore, God's foreknowledge cannot be the reason of our election, because when God [looks into the future and] surveys all mankind, he will find them all, from the first to the last, under the same curse. So we see how foolishly triflers prattle when they ascribe to mere naked foreknowledge what must be founded on God's good pleasure. . . .

When Moses prays to God not to break his covenant with Abraham, God answers, "I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion." What does he mean? He means that the reason for God's keeping some for himself and rejecting 295 others is to be sought nowhere but in God himself. When he says, "I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion," the repetition may seem empty and dull; but it is in reality emphatic. . . . The reason for compassion is compassion itself..."

Mercy, and not debt.

Loitering on my homepage I also remembered this gem from blue-duncan, who has been absent of late and is missed.

"The whole sacrificial system was poor copy of the reality that was in heaven and looked forward to it breaking into time. A believer's life will catch up with his election in time. At present, believers are seen as perfect in Christ and yet our sanctification is in process and ultimately when we are in the presence of Jesus our sanctification will catch up with the perfection that God sees us in now." -- blue-duncan (9/30/06)

To God belongs all the glory.

10,747 posted on 07/01/2008 11:28:16 AM PDT by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10665 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson