Posted on 05/30/2008 10:21:34 AM PDT by Ultra Sonic 007
But, but, that’s a misrepresenation of the Pope’s actual words!!!!
”And I suspect enat and I have very different epistemologies.”
I really appreciate the time and thought that you took in replying to the intent of my questions. It appeared to me, sitting on the sidelines that either the parties were communicating past each other or they had not thought through or been personally convinced of their foundational principle and were just reacting emotionally as can happen when epistemology is based on #8, #10 and #11 on your list; thus, my questions to clarify what their basis for belief were.
I don’t think our epistemologies are that far apart. In my teaching, over the years, I have sometimes used similar theories, however compressed into four or five categories.
After graduate school I had the good fortune to listen to a lecture given by the popular philosopher, Dr. Mortimer Adler. As an aside during the question and answer period, he made mention of his study that persuaded him that there is a God. He was finishing a book on the subject which later became “How to Think About God”. Prior to that time I had not paid much attention to the subject of God, relying on some pretheoretical sense of, “whatever is, is” and my family and church saying “He is”. After reading his book and his recommendations for further study, Thomas Aquinas, Anselm, Kant and some of Koestler, although persuaded by the evidence, I still was not convinced with certainty. Logic took me just so far, persuaded me beyond a reasonable doubt, as the lawyers say, but not the certitude I wanted. The orderliness and consequent predictability of the world seemed to have traces of a transcendent being that caused it to come into being but the evidence of entropy and increasing disorder and chaos militated against that understanding. Kant’s “upper level” didn’t solve the problem. That just seemed like a cop out; like ascribing intellectual laziness to mystery.
I have made it a point to press my students to think through what they consider the “really real” and why they think it is substantial enough to risk their all based on it and then be able to give an accurate account of it. Most will use some evasive terms to cover any unthought of concepts, and that is acceptable as long as they are aware they are doing it.
ena
I don’t think I could say enough about the Bible being the Word of God. You need to read it for yourself. Bible believing Christians believe the Bible and all of its authors who wrote under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit.
I know full-well what the RCC thinks of reformers and Protestants and all those who do not bow to Rome. I don't care what they think. And I don't care what they say about me or my church.
Unlike the RCs on this forum, I don't demand that anyone stop disagreeing with me or my church. I think the more the light of Scripture is proclaimed, the better we all can see.
I am fully confident that everyone is where God wants them to be today. Tomorrow will be different for many. God instructed us to preach the Gospel in order for men to know that "Jesus Christ" is the only name under heaven by which they can be saved. All to whom God gives ears to hear will know the truth of their salvation by Christ risen, each according to God's gift of the indwelling Holy Spirit given at a time of His choosing.
I don't know how much idolatry God winks at. I don't know how long God will keep an acquitted man in a church that prays to the creature and believes there are "another Christ" and who thinks Mary "shares Christ's work of redemption on the cross."
Certainly not forever. Post Tenebras Lux.
Thankfully, it's His call, not mine. But His word tells me clearly not to praise, venerate, worship, glorify or kneel to any name but His.
Mr. Spurgeon, Mr. Whitefield, Mr. Wesley, Mr. Watts, Mr. Newton, Mr. (Jonathan) Edwards, Mr. (Dwight) Moody, Mr. Ratzinger. -— I thought I was putting the man, whom I have never met, and of whom I've probably seen fewer than a dozen photos thus far, in very good company.
Some of you folks are running around just calling him “Ratzinger,” as if you were in the next bunk with him in Marine basic training. But I see that this is common in articles written about him, and people don't get upset about it. I think in journalism this is considered to be acceptable.
Then the name got changed in the questioning, and I was asked whether I thought “ . . . Benedict . . .” was saved. Honestly, I cannot remember the numbers, and I don't know how many “Benedicts” there were were among these “successors.” I also do not know the purpose of their using an alias, how the names are chosen, or who chooses them.
I am not being disrespectful. I simply and honestly don't believe that any man on earth has any obligation to play these name games, or to join in to the exaltation of clergymen. Those who want to believe that there is one visible “church” on earth today that is the visible “Kingdom of God” on earth are also free to believe (if they wish) that they should exalt one man who kind o’ looks like a king on a throne. But others don't have any obligation to view that man in the same light.
I never heard of deMontort and probably won’t read him.
[Matthew 12:
46] While he was still speaking to the people, behold, his mother and his brothers stood outside, asking to speak to him.
Did she pull "mother" rank?
As to your last sentence-—I agree—in the understanding that all praise, veneration, worship. glory and kneeling is directed to, in and with The Lord of Lords, Christ Jesus.
As for the rest—I regret your tone to me.
Maybe he should google Laminin.
Again, stop trying to stuff words into the Pope's mouth. He did not refer to defective Christians.
Instead of just going along with the gross misrepresentation, we give you the same old stuff: truth.
Agreed.
BZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZTTTTTTTTTTTTTT.
Fix your keyboard.
Yes.
If your posts are any guide, that's false.
Nor do I or Scripture make God into a mugger when it came to Paul.
Read your Bible.
Yes, well, you said the most you'll refer to someone as is Mister, or if they're a Christian, Brother. You pointedly referred to the Pope as Mr.
Gabriel came for Mary's consent and she gave it. Without her consent, it was rape. The Holy Spirit is not a rapist.
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