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To: fortheDeclaration
The Mary of the Roman Catholic Church is not the Mary of the Bible.

I think you're right. The Mary of the RCC has all kinds of supernatural powers none of which can be found in Scripture.

I don't believe Mary truly knew who Jesus was until the Resurrection. She rebuked him in his Father's house when he was a child talking with the Rabbi's. She came with his brothers to take him home when he was beginning his ministry. Yet, when all fled except for John she stayed to the end.

576 posted on 04/04/2008 2:23:34 PM PDT by wmfights (Believe - THE GOSPEL - and be saved)
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To: wmfights
The Mary of the Roman Catholic Church is not the Mary of the Bible.

I think you're right. The Mary of the RCC has all kinds of supernatural powers none of which can be found in Scripture.

The Mary which some think is the Mary of the Roman Catholic Church (and of the other Catholic Churches as well) is not in fact the Mary of the Roman Catholic Church(or of the other Catholic Churches). This leads to our spending almost equal amounts of time clarifying that we don't believe what people say w e believe and explaining what we DO in fact teach.

Any powers Mary has, just like any powers you have, are gifts from God and maintained by God's grace and by nothing else.

It would be a nice change to talk about what what the Church actually teaches rather than the splendid craziness we are accused of believing. Why we are expected to trust people to tell us the truth about God when they don't trouble to tell us the truth about ourselves is something I don't get.

It's like the cold call I got from a brokerage house: they lied to me about a previous call and then expected me to trust them with my money. The one thing they said to me that I actually knew something about was false, and they were asking me to trust them about what I couldn't verify.

Similarly with the Mary Ann Collins article, or whatever her name is. If "she", claiming to be a former nun, no less, doesn't understand or misrepresents papal infallibility, something which takes about 15 minutes to nail down, why should I believe anything she says?

583 posted on 04/04/2008 2:39:36 PM PDT by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
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To: wmfights

“I don’t believe Mary truly knew who Jesus was until the Resurrection.”

Luke l 46-55

And Mary said, My soul doth magnify the Lord. And my spirit hath rejoiced in God my Savior. Because he hath regarded the humility of his handmaid,

for behold from henceforth ALL GENERATION SHALL CALL ME BLESSED.

Because he that is mighty HATH DONE GREAT THINGS TO ME; and holy is his name.

And his mercy is from generation unto generations, to them that fear him.

He hath shewed might in his arm, he hath scattered the proud in the conceit of the heart.

He hath put down the might from their seat and hath exalted the humble.

He hath RECEIVED ISRAEL HIS SERVANT BEING MINDFUL OF HIS MERCY.

AS HE SPOKE TO OUR FATHER, TO ABRAHAM AND TO HIS SEED FOREVER.

Mary speaks not of herself but of the knowledge that her conception by the Holy Spirit as announced by Gabriel and assented to by Mary herself means salvation as promised to Abraham and his seed forever.

Luke: 1-67/69

“And Zachary his father was filled with the Holy Spirit and he prophesied, saying:
Blessed be the Lord God of Israel; because he hath visited and wrought the REDEMPTION OF HIS PEOPLE.
And hath raised up an horn of salvation to us, in the house of David his serant.”

Zachary was a cousin of Mary’s by marriage and a Levite. He is speaking of the horn, his new born son, John, as the one to bring news of the salvation in the House of David.

Mary certainly knew of this prophecy within the family itself. In fact, since Zachary’s muteness was common knowledge along with his wife’s very late conception, a lot of people would have known of this prophecy.

73. The oath which He swore to Abraham our father, that would grant to us, that being delivered from the hand of our enemies, we may serve him without fear.

76. And though child (John) shall be called the prophet of the Highest; for thou shalt go before the of the Lord to prepare his ways.

Luke l 41-44
And it came to pass, that when Elizabeth heard the salutaion of Mary, the infant leaped in her womb. And Elizabeth was filled with the HOLY GHOST/

And she cried out with a loud voice, Blessed art thou among woman and blessed is the fruit of they womb.

And whence is this to me that the mother of my Lord should come to me?

For behold, as soon as the voice of thy salutaiton sounded in my ears, the infant in my womb leaped for joy.

Elizabeth pregnant with John the Baptist is greeting Mary as Theotokos, God Bearer.

To say that Mary didn’t understand is really to lump her in with other pregnant barefoot women trying to hide the cake in the oven because the ring wasn’t on her finger.


586 posted on 04/04/2008 3:03:17 PM PDT by OpusatFR
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