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To: Forest Keeper; MarkBsnr; stfassisi; irishtenor; Dr. Eckleburg; Gamecock
How do you know that Moses and Joshua and David and the rest of them were not reporting what they saw, but you believe that the Gospels were "factual" reporting? You can't prove that

What they "saw" and "heard" was not a physical, inarnate God, FK. Now, you can believe whatever you want, but Christians believe no one has seen God in person except in Christ. The beauty of the Gospels as a witness is that more than one person saw and heard Him.

This is not the case with the OT, where God is revealed to specific individuals in a mysterious way through visions, dreams even hallucinations.

6,367 posted on 07/02/2008 8:07:15 AM PDT by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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To: kosta50

***What they “saw” and “heard” was not a physical, inarnate God, FK. Now, you can believe whatever you want, but Christians believe no one has seen God in person except in Christ. The beauty of the Gospels as a witness is that more than one person saw and heard Him.

This is not the case with the OT, where God is revealed to specific individuals in a mysterious way through visions, dreams even hallucinations.***

Well spoken.

Exodus 33:

17
The LORD said to Moses, “This request, too, which you have just made, I will carry out, because you have found favor with me and you are my intimate friend.”
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Then Moses said, “Do let me see your glory!”
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He answered, “I will make all my beauty pass before you, and in your presence I will pronounce my name, ‘LORD’; I who show favors to whom I will, I who grant mercy to whom I will.
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But my face you cannot see, for no man sees me and still lives.
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Here,” continued the LORD, “is a place near me where you shall station yourself on the rock.
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When my glory passes I will set you in the hollow of the rock and will cover you with my hand until I have passed by.
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3 Then I will remove my hand, so that you may see my back; but my face is not to be seen.”

Colossians 1:

13
He delivered us from the power of darkness and transferred us to the kingdom of his beloved Son,
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in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.
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6 He is the image 7 of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation.

1 Timothy 1:

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To the king of ages, 8 incorruptible, invisible, the only God, honor and glory forever and ever. Amen.

1 John 4:

12
No one has ever seen God. Yet, if we love one another, God remains in us, and his love is brought to perfection in us.

Those who have ‘seen’ God have seen the shape, shadow, image, what have you, that God has shaped for us to see.

We cannot ‘see’ God as He is. Our human bounds will not permit it.


6,369 posted on 07/02/2008 9:15:37 AM PDT by MarkBsnr ( I would not believe in the Gospel if the authority of the Catholic Church did not move me to do so.)
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To: kosta50; MarkBsnr; stfassisi; irishtenor; Dr. Eckleburg; Gamecock
What they "saw" and "heard" was not a physical, incarnate God, FK. Now, you can believe whatever you want, but Christians believe no one has seen God in person except in Christ.

So what if it wasn't a physical and incarnate God in the OT? Is that the only way you believe God can or chose to communicate with us? If so, then you do not believe in an indwelling Holy Spirit.

The beauty of the Gospels as a witness is that more than one person saw and heard Him.

You yourself have pointed out that there are several passages in the Gospels in which there could have been no other direct witnesses, such as His trials in the desert and when He prayed to take the cup away. Yet, (I hope :) you accept those as true. The scriptures are authenticated by GOD, not by how many humans were around to vouch for them.

6,380 posted on 07/03/2008 3:44:26 AM PDT by Forest Keeper (It is a joy to me to know that God had my number, before He created numbers.)
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