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To: RinaseaofDs
This is your view of salvation

No, this is the Biblical view of salvation, as evidenced by the many verses from Scripture I've offered.

They aren't predestined. WE GET TO CHOOSE.

Unregenerated man will always choose sin and the regenerated man will choose righteousness.

Regeneration by God's grace through faith is a gift given by God to whom He will. A man must be born again, not by the will of the flesh, or of the will of man, but by the will of God through the work of the indwelling Holy Spirit.

"According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved." -- Ephesians 1:4-6

We are "made accepted in Christ" by God's grace, for God's glory.

Judas wasn't a patsy - he chose too, just like Peter did. Both betrayed Jesus, and worse, Peter knew better.

How did "Peter know better?" Was Peter a "better" human being than Judas? Did God give Peter something He withheld from Judas?

"For who maketh thee to differ from another? and what hast thou that thou didst not receive?" -- 1 Corinthians 4:7

5,174 posted on 04/26/2008 12:11:26 PM PDT by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
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To: Dr. Eckleburg

Jesus told Peter what Peter was going to do before he did it.

That’s what makes him ‘know better’.

You actually believe, in a Universe (perhaps Universes) created by God, that the natural state of all things is EVIL?

Your verses are off-point here. You still have a choice to make - do you accept Christ, or don’t you.

The Holy Spirit doesn’t indwell until you make this choice. That simple.

Judas chose. Peter Chose. Cain chose. Eve chose.

You choose, unless you can’t choose, and then I don’t have a clue what happens.

You can’t wish it away - Free Will Exists.

This is DEFINITELY your view of salvation, in that this is the way you’ve chosen to read it from the Bible. I read it differently, and obviously so do many others, including the Pope, and the entire Lutheran Church.

Those churches even have CONFIRMATION. Baptism was done when you had NO CHOICE. Confirmation affirms the choice made for you, and literally ‘seals’ the deal - with oil even. On the forehead.

Your verses aren’t evidence. Satan can quote scripture too.

Unless you are telling me that your interpretation is the ONLY interpretation of the Bible that can be permitted, you are going to have to come to grips with the fact that OTHERS can, and have, interpreted it a different way.

In the end, I think it’s better to teach that the God made the Universe good, and that He loves you, and wants you to succeed, and that none of us have been dealt the Ace of Spades somehow before we were born.

We come to God because we see Christ sacrifice for what it is, and are eternally grateful for it, and that’s it.

We literally live happily ever after.

You want to teach somebody that the true nature of man is evil, and that only those predestined to be saved actually have a shot at it, and in that number, only a smaller fraction there in actually make it to being saved - that’s on you.


5,188 posted on 04/27/2008 11:30:37 PM PDT by RinaseaofDs
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