I'm assuming you have a through knowledge of scripture, right? It is for you and all Protestants the sole rule of faith so it would be a given that you would have already read the Scripture I would post, correct. Since you have already created a line of belief from you reading of Scripture and of the Institutes, how would me posting averse, chapter or even a whole book change you views? It would not, has not and will not until you commit to read the Holy Writ with new eyes. Not in the piecemeal pretexting fashion we are so used to here on FR but in a coherent, cogent way that brings to life the greatest love story ever written: Gods love for man.
Well, doesn't it sure sound exactly like the real idolatry that is described for us in the Bible? :
The Duck billed Platypus has a bill, webbed feet and lays eggs, but it is not a duck. If these people actually believed that the stone answered their prayers, that would be idolatry, but with out talking to them, delving deep into their understanding of intercessory prayer and the role of the saints in heaven, then it's merely a case of projection.
You are truly gracious not to judge, but your fear of iconography is a heresy we dealt with long ago and is your own problem, not the problem of properly catechized believers. I will note, however, that proper catechesis is sorely lacking in many parts of the world, the US is no exception.
The Church is two fold. There is the body of believers holding the faith as handed to us from the institutional Church founded by Christ, which is hierarchal in design and perfect in it's teaching role as it regards the faith "who hears you, hears Me". We are free to question may things, just not reveled truth, that would be a folly of pride.
Well, unless your point, together with your scripture is consistent with the totality of inspired scripture, then you're not going to change my views. But then, neither would you change my views using uninspired sources, unless they were in conformity with the totality of inspired scripture. So, I don't understand why you would need to note the difference. Besides, among the principals on all sides around here, I doubt there are going to be many major conversions. :) There are plenty of lurkers, though, who might benefit greatly from the various comments. In addition to that, I have learned a tremendous amount from those of like minds in their postings. It's all win-win.
[continuing:] It would not, has not and will not until you commit to read the Holy Writ with new eyes. Not in the piecemeal pretexting fashion we are so used to here on FR but in a coherent, cogent way that brings to life the greatest love story ever written: Gods love for man.
But I've already done that by the grace of God. God gives all believers new ears and new eyes. His word IS life.
The Duck billed Platypus has a bill, webbed feet and lays eggs, but it is not a duck. If these people actually believed that the stone answered their prayers, that would be idolatry ...
It would be the WORST kind of idolatry, but not the only kind. I looked into this a little, and as I recently posted to Dr. E., I did find Biblical examples where it appeared that the idol itself WAS the false god. However, there are other examples which appear to show a conduit to a false god. For example:
Deut 16:21-22 : 21 Do not set up any wooden Asherah pole beside the altar you build to the Lord your God, 22 and do not erect a sacred stone, for these the Lord your God hates.
Asherah was supposedly a goddess, so it would not have been the pole itself. Presumably the poles (or trees) were used in conjunction with prayer of some sort. So here, we see that God hates even the idea of a conduit. Further evidence:
2 Kings 21:7-11 : 7 He took the carved Asherah pole he had made and put it in the temple, of which the Lord had said to David and to his son Solomon, "In this temple and in Jerusalem, which I have chosen out of all the tribes of Israel, I will put my Name forever. 8 I will not again make the feet of the Israelites wander from the land I gave their forefathers, if only they will be careful to do everything I commanded them and will keep the whole Law that my servant Moses gave them." 9 But the people did not listen. Manasseh led them astray, so that they did more evil than the nations the Lord had destroyed before the Israelites. 10 The Lord said through his servants the prophets: 11 "Manasseh king of Judah has committed these detestable sins. He has done more evil than the Amorites who preceded him and has led Judah into sin with his idols.
So here we have reference to the pole being called an idol, and since it was placed in the Temple, it must have something to do with prayer to the separate entity, Asherah. God says the idols are evil. It would be easy to say that the only thing God hated was that the idols were "to" the wrong God. However, in my previous post to you I quoted:
Deut 4:16 : 16 so that you do not become corrupt and make for yourselves an idol, an image of any shape, whether formed like a man or a woman, ...
There is no reference to the image being to a false god or not. It just says no "image of any shape, whether formed like a man or a woman ..." God hates the idol itself, regardless if it was intended for noble purposes or not. He knows what the danger is to us of falling into the idol and away from Him.