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To: Forest Keeper; MarkBsnr; Kolokotronis; stfassisi; HarleyD; Dr. Eckleburg; blue-duncan; wmfights
Mark: Are you saying that Jesus is a separate entity from God?

Forest Keeper: The Son is a separate person from the Father and the Spirit...

You forgot to aqualify it by "in the Divine Economy of our salvation."

I think Kosta was saying or implying that Jesus was free to disobey the will of the Father, and I disagree with that.

Then He wasn't fully human.

I was trying to show that Jesus told the truth when He said He came to do the will of the Father, and that He never deviated once.

Then the  Son is subordinate to the Father. That's Arian heresy.

Because they are not apart I don't think it was possible for Him to deviate.

If they are not apart then we can't speak of God as somehting separate from Christ, to wit your saying "By never sinning He did everything God wanted Him to do." This is the same troubling concept used by Apostle Paul when he says that "God [sic] raised" Christ.  It suggests, as Mark observes, that Christ is a separate entity from God.

 

 

3,982 posted on 03/13/2008 7:48:05 PM PDT by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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To: kosta50; Forest Keeper; wmfights; HarleyD; blue-duncan
Of course Christ will always do the will of God because Christ is God.

When we even flirt with the idea that Christ could disobey God we deconstruct the Trinity into meaninglessness.

The Godhead is three persons in "one substance, power and eternity." That essence is the same and always in accord with itself and is eternally self-authenticating. God cannot contradict Himself. God is not divided against Himself.

"No lie is of the truth." -- John 2:21


"[God] cannot deny himself" -- 2 Timothy 2:13


"God...cannot lie." -- Titus 1:2

WESTMINSTER CONFESSION OF FAITH: "In the unity of the Godhead there be three Persons of one substance, power, and eternity: God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Ghost. The Father is of none, neither begotten nor proceeding; the Son is eternally begotten of the Father; the Holy Ghost eternally proceeding from the Father and the Son."

4,003 posted on 03/14/2008 11:18:15 AM PDT by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
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To: kosta50; MarkBsnr; Kolokotronis; stfassisi; HarleyD; Dr. Eckleburg; blue-duncan; wmfights; ...
FK: "I think Kosta was saying or implying that Jesus was free to disobey the will of the Father, and I disagree with that."

Then He wasn't fully human.

Of course He was fully human. But not only was He NOT stained by original sin, He was also fully God. Jesus said:

Matt 6:24 : "No one can serve two masters . Either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and Money.

Neither could fully human Jesus serve both God and satan, AS God. It just couldn't happen.

FK: "I was trying to show that Jesus told the truth when He said He came to do the will of the Father, and that He never deviated once."

Then the Son is subordinate to the Father. That's Arian heresy.

Jesus said:

John 6:38-39 : 38 For I have come down from heaven not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me. 39 And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all that he has given me, but raise them up at the last day.

Your argument is with Jesus Himself, not me. :)

4,274 posted on 03/18/2008 2:39:00 PM PDT by Forest Keeper (It is a joy to me to know that God had my number, before He created numbers.)
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