Posted on 01/27/2008 7:56:14 PM PST by Manfred the Wonder Dawg
January 25, 2008
ESV Romans 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel, for it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes, to the Jew first and also to the Greek.
In recent days I have spent time in Lima and Sullana Peru and Mexico City and I have discovered that people by nature are the same. Man has a heart that is inclined to selfishness and idolatry. Sin abounds in the remotest parts of the land because the heart is desperately wicked. Thousands bow before statues of Mary and pray to her hoping for answers. I have seen these people stare hopelessly at Mary icons, Jesus icons, and a host of dead saints who will do nothing for them. I have talked with people who pray to the pope and say that they love him. I talked with one lady who said that she knew that Jesus was the Savior, but she loved the pope. Thousands bow before Santa Muerte (holy death angel) in hopes that she will do whatever they ask her. I have seen people bring money, burning cigarettes, beer, whiskey, chocolate, plants, and flowers to Santa Muerte in hopes of her answers. I have seen these people bowing on their knees on the concrete in the middle of public places to worship their idol. Millions of people come into the Basilica in Mexico City and pay their money, confess their sins, and stare hopelessly at relics in hope that their sins will be pardoned. In America countless thousands are chained to baseball games, football games, material possessions, and whatever else their heart of idols can produce to worship.
My heart has broken in these last weeks because the God of heaven is not honored as he ought to be honored. People worship the things that are created rather than worshiping the Creator. God has been gracious to all mankind and yet mankind has hardened their hearts against a loving God. God brings the rain on the just and unjust. God brings the beautiful sunrises and sunsets upon the just and unjust. God gives good gifts unto all and above all things he has given his Son that those who would believe in him would be saved. However, man has taken the good things of God and perverted them unto idols and turned their attention away from God. I get a feel for Jesus as he overlooked Jerusalem or Paul as he beseeched for God to save Israel. When you accept the reality of the truth of the glory of God is breaks your heart that people would turn away from the great and awesome God of heaven to serve lesser things. Moses was outraged by the golden calf, the prophets passionately preached against idolatry, Jesus was angered that the temple was changed in an idolatrous business, and Paul preached to the idolaters of Mars Hill by telling them of the unknown God.
I arrived back at home wondering how I should respond to all the idolatry that I have beheld in these last three weeks. I wondered how our church here in the states should respond to all of the idolatry in the world. What are the options? First, I suppose we could sit around and hope that people chose to get their life together and stop being idolaters. However, I do not know how that could ever happen apart from them hearing the truth. Second, I suppose we could spend a lifetime studying cultural issues and customs in hope that we could somehow learn to relate to the people of other countries. However, the bible is quite clear that all men are the same. Men are dead in sin, shaped in iniquity, and by nature are the enemies of God. Thirdly, we could pay other people or other agencies to go and do a work for us while we remain comfortably in the states. However, there is no way to insure that there will be doctrinal accuracy or integrity. If we only pay other people to take the gospel we will miss out on all of the benefits of being obedient to the mission of God. Lastly, we could seek where God would have us to do a lasting work and then invest our lives there for the glory of God. The gospel has the power to raise the dead in any culture and we must be willing to take the gospel wherever God would have us take it. It is for sure that our church cannot go to every country and reach every people group, so we must determine where God would have us work and seek to be obedient wherever that is.
It seems that some doors are opening in the Spanish speaking countries below us and perhaps God is beginning to reveal where we are to work. There are some options for work to be partnered with in Peru and there could be a couple of options in Mexico. The need is greater than I can express upon this paper for a biblical gospel to be proclaimed in Peru and Mexico. Oh, that God would glorify his great name in Peru and Mexico by using a small little church in a town that does not exist to proclaim his great gospel amongst a people who desperately need the truth.
I give thanks to the LORD for allowing me the privilege of going to these countries and broadening my horizons. The things that I have seen will be forever engraved upon my heart. I will long remember the pastors that I spent time with in Peru and I will never forget Adolfo who translated for me in Mexico. I will relish the time that I spent with Paul Washer and the others. When I think of church I will forever remember being on top of that mountain in Sullana at that church which had no electricity and no roof. I am convinced that heaven was looking down on that little church on top of that mountain and very few people on earth even know that it exist. Oh, God I pray that the things of this world will continue to grow dim and that God’s people will be caught up in his glorious presence.
Because of the truth: Pastor: J. Randall Easter II Timothy 2:19 "Our God is in heaven and does whatever He pleases."(Ps. 115:3) "He predestined us according to the good pleasure of His will."(Eph. 1:5) Those who have been saved have been saved for His glory and they are being made holy for this is the will of God. Are you being made holy? Spurgeon says, "If your religion does not make you holy it will damn you to hell."
An Apostolic Church eh!.. Which one?.. Peter, Paul, Apollos?
What negative theology? You mean apophatic? Are you sure you understand what that means?
So, how do you draw the line between ethical and unethical. If lies boost the sales, long live America? How is that different from businesses hiring illegal aliens out of greed and not caring what that does to America's security?
I guess as long as we make a sale, the path doesn't matter. Truly revealing.
The Church viewed Cassian's teachings as heretical. Shouldn't that be sufficient?
You have no proof nor do you have sufficient evidence.
What evidence do I need? I'm not the one who sits in judgment. I'm merely stating venerating statues made with hands is idolatry. Let him who have ears hear.
We can and we do.
So, what is the meaning of venerate?
Can we pull together a coherant post please?
Sometimes I think people can grasp certain concepts. The Orthodox view was built on a synergistic model that believed in man's will to change his life. Their touted saint is none other than Saint Cassian who had a great influence on the Orthodox view. On the other side was the Latin who branded (at least initially) Cassian as a heretic, favoring Augustine's view of salvation as a gift from God. After all, it does state that in scripture although few actually believe that it is a GIFT; instead thinking they did something (had faith, was baptized, etc.). Few look upon the church/Church as the "chosen" nation of God. Instead most veiw it as the "chosing" nation of God.
No, just the Protestant interpretation of Paul,and the emphasis on Paul and OT over Gospels.
You have problems with Apostles too?
“Bottom line: my tagline is a lot more factual then claiming indwelling spirit.”
You believe that it is just as I believe that the Holy Spirit indwells me, and interestingly enough, both statements use the same evidence, the Word, the church and experience.
***What negative theology? You mean apophatic? Are you sure you understand what that means?***
LOL
I don’t know?!
Hey, you took off my smiley face :>(
“a moral message. Somoene is used as an example for others to learn.”
These examples are not moral messages for others but tests of the individual’s commitment and loyalty. When they were going through the testing they had no idea of being used as examples.
Hbr 11:17 By faith Abraham, when he was tried, offered up Isaac: and he that had received the promises offered up his only begotten [son],
Jam 1:12 Blessed [is] the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him.
1Pe 1:7 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:
The difference between testing and temptation is in the intent of the initiator. When God subjected Jesus to hunger in the desert it was to test him in his reliance on God but when Satan tempted him in the same situation it was to sin by relying on himself to perform a miracle to satisy his personal hunger.
Here is the funny part. We post scripture STRAIGHT from the Bible and you call it an interpretation. That’s hilarious. Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha...
Well, that's pretty much the first step in apophatic theology, I believe. So you've made a good start.
And I don't know about you, but when I don't know, which is all the time, I take comfort in my confidence that I am known.
I don't know anybody important -- not to where you'd say "know", but somebody REALLY important knows me.
I thought you were “off” for Lent?
Is Lent over?
Not the originals?..
The job security of hand me down authority gives me the heebie jeeepies..
I know about the strange teachers(heretics) and such..
So I understand the logic of the hand me downs.. but I don;t like the concept of it..
AMEN!
This can't be said enough. We get so smart sometimes we outsmart ourselves.
No. Our liturgy is unchanged form the 4th century. We worship the same was as the Church did in the 4th century. And we teach the same doctrine that Church taught. We are the same Church doctrinally and worship-wise as the Church that canonized the Bible. These are facts. Your indwelling spirit could be the HS or demons or just pure voices of insanity. Two different hings. One is objective the other is subjective.
I thought you had no clue. But you didn’t answer my other questrion: what is supposedly “negative” about our theology?
Waste of bandwidth. :)
So are MOST of our posts :>)
“One is objective the other is subjective.”
You are still relying on what someone else believed to be true. You don’t have the same documents that the 1st century had, nor do your priest have the same garments, nor did the 1st century church have the relics you use, nor the commentaries you use, nor do you know that the liturgy you use was used in the 1st century church. You are relying by faith that what your church heirarchy and history is telling you is the truth. You weren’t there when the early church started so you are using reason, probability, that what you believe is true.
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