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To: Mad Dawg; Dr. Eckleburg; XeniaSt
And evidently you did, without doing your research first. To say
The Catholic church thinks sex is sinful is so vague and yet sweeping. Do you mean the Church TEACHES that sex is sinful, or SOME members think sex is sinful or what EXACTLY do you mean? DO you have an exact meaning?

There are a couple. The fact that married priests were told not to have sex before they said mass,. and then there is the tradition of "churching" which was to clean a woman from sin after child birth. But mostly and significantly it is the absolute need to keep poor Mary a virgin FOREVER .That is so she remains pure and 'undefiled' in the eyes of men

Similarly, chaste intercourse, that is, loving sexual intercourse with one's spouse and open to life and consecrated virginity are both virtuous.But since in heaven "they neither marry nor are given in marriage", as my ouija board says, consecrated virginity is what you might call a "higher" estate, bieng more like the heavenly state,in certain sense. (For example, no mother-in-law.) Not all consecrated virgins are "higher" than chaste spouses, but the situation is "higher". Paul says something about this.

Paul is talking about men in ministry I believe.

So it is"chaste" and loving to have intercourse between spouses BUT it is MORE holy to deny your spouse? Mary was NOT in heaven as the mother of Jesus she was a flesh and blood woman, she had a husband. You make her a human demi god. If God intended her to remain a virgin he would not have given her a husband.

But as to the "MUST", I'm not sure what you mean.

I said MUST because Catholics have mini seizures when one suggests she may have has a chase and loving sexual relationship with her husband..so it is CLEAR that to Catholics she MUST remain a virgin

As for me, my salvation and my eternity do not rest on this question, Jesus has already said he loves me as much as his mother and I have a normal marriage :)

844 posted on 10/28/2007 12:52:39 PM PDT by ears_to_hear (1Cr 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God:......)
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To: ears_to_hear
I said MUST because Catholics have mini seizures when one suggests she may have has a chase and loving sexual relationship with her husband..so it is CLEAR that to Catholics she MUST remain a virgin.

If that's an argument, it goes right by me. It could just be that they believe that she WAS, not that she somehow "MUST" be. Maybe you could rephrase your question in a way designed to be both clear and not gratuitously offensive.

I keep looking for arguments and finding nothing but speculations built on tenuous conjectures. The Protestant Episcopal Church had a "Churching of Women" which morphed in 1979 into a Thanksgiving after child birth. One of the things involved there is that Mary was "churched" (mutatis mutandis), and if it's good enough for the Mother of the Lord, hey, who are we to argue?

I dealt with the fallacious conclusion from abstention before Mass.

You have yet to show an absolute need, so no more need be said there. It's a groundless assertion.

Paul is talking about men in ministry I believe.

Well, of course, being, as so many here are so eager to tell me, an ignorant Catholic who does not read his Bible and wouldn't understand it if I did, I wouldn't know about 1 Cor 7:25-40, and especially those parts dealing with παρθενων (v 25), η γυνη η αγαμος και η παρθενος (v 34) but that sure sounds like women to me.

If God intended her to remain a virgin he would not have given her a husband.

You know, it's not any more persuasive in bold than it is in normal typeface.

875 posted on 10/28/2007 2:09:42 PM PDT by Mad Dawg (Oh Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee.)
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