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To: Forest Keeper; Dr. Eckleburg; MarkBsnr; P-Marlowe; xzins; Kolokotronis; jo kus; D-fendr
The wickedness we are born with in our nature is removed when we receive our new nature. We are a new creation. However, a REMNANT of our old nature does remain, so we still sin from time to time

What? Who removes our wickedness? Is it not the Holy Spirit? Are you saying He is doing an incomplete job? I must admit, this is a new one.

St. Paul doesn't think there is a "remannt," FK:

To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect [Heb12:23]


8,567 posted on 10/08/2007 7:58:01 PM PDT by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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To: kosta50; Dr. Eckleburg; MarkBsnr; P-Marlowe; xzins; Kolokotronis; jo kus; D-fendr
What? Who removes our wickedness? Is it not the Holy Spirit? Are you saying He is doing an incomplete job? I must admit, this is a new one.

God changes our nature by giving us a new heart. We are a new creation (2 Cor. 5:17). But left behind is a remnant of the old nature which is why we continue to sin even as believers. It was obviously God's plan that we continue to grow through sanctification for the rest of our lives after belief. If we had been transformed into perfection at the point of salvation, then that would have been moot. It is not a matter of an incomplete job. The complete job was to have us always striving towards Him. Mission accomplished. :)

St. Paul doesn't think there is a "remnant," FK:

To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect [Heb12:23]

Do I take it that you now officially recognize Paul as the author of Hebrews? LOL! :)

In any event, Paul is the one guy we can be most sure about in knowing that man is never devoid of sin. Paul himself openly admits that even after his personal experience with Christ and his total conversion he still sins:

Rom 7:15-19 : 15 I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. 16 And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. 17 As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. 18 I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. 19 For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do — this I keep on doing.

Paul is fully saved when he says this, so if this isn't proof positive that Paul believed in the remnant then I don't know what is. :) Paul's use of "perfect" obviously does not equal "sinless".

8,648 posted on 10/10/2007 3:02:34 AM PDT by Forest Keeper (It is a joy to me to know that God had my number, before He created numbers.)
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