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To: jo kus; kosta50
Well, I hadn't expected that reply from a person of the Reformed persuasion. If it is true, that is good to hear, with the caveat that there is no repentance without grace from above. I imagine you'd agree, since you posted the pertinent Scriptures.

Every Christian (well almost) understand one must repent. What the scriptures tells us is that God must be the author of bringing us to repentance. The fact that all men do not come to repentance's is another indication that God does not bring all men to repentance.

As Augustine stated; "Command what you will, and grant what you command." God has commanded all men to repent. God must also grant men the ability to repent.

People fail to understand that it is God's will that drives everything. As James stated:

Something we should all ponder.
6,834 posted on 09/21/2007 1:51:32 AM PDT by HarleyD
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To: HarleyD

Why should men repent if the non elect will go to hell? Under Reformed theology, they will go to hell regardless if they believe or not; they will go to hell regardless if they repent or not.

There is fundamental illogic with the Reformed thought. If all of men’s efforts are worth nothing, why should they do anything? If one views Scripture through that prism, then anything one does is mechanical and means nothing.


6,852 posted on 09/21/2007 5:43:40 AM PDT by MarkBsnr (V. Angelus Domini nuntiavit Mariae. R. Et concepit de Spiritu Sancto.)
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To: HarleyD
As Augustine stated; "Command what you will, and grant what you command." God has commanded all men to repent. God must also grant men the ability to repent.

I disagree that God does NOT give all men the ABILITY to repent. We believe that God gives SUFFICIENT graces to all men, sufficient in of themselves to bring a man to repentance. However, a MAN must ALSO WANT to repent. Otherwise, it is not HIS repentance.

Again, we are back to "who is judged, God or man?" If God provides only some men with sufficient grace to repent, then it is GOD who would be judged, because that man could then say "you didn't give me the ability to repent, so HOW could I?" Regards

6,853 posted on 09/21/2007 5:47:46 AM PDT by jo kus
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To: HarleyD; jo kus
God has commanded all men to repent. God must also grant men the ability to repent

Then all men should be able to repent and be saved, but choose not to. It's their choice, not God's. He chose to offer. They refused. Our cooperation is required. God won't drag the unwilling to Him.

6,888 posted on 09/21/2007 8:41:09 AM PDT by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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