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To: P-Marlowe
Child abuse is compelling evidence that God did not appoint that person to that position. God would not ordain a child molester to be in a postition of authority over children. So if the Church appointed them, then the Church acted against God's will and without the authority of God.

But Jesus chose Judas who committed the worst of crimes, does that mean He acted against God's will and was without the authority of God? Following your logic that would be the conclusion. That some men in any assembly (ecclesia--church) fall short of the Gospel doesn't mean that the assembly is godless.

The arguments being presented for apostolic succession are objective and scriptural, not subjective (i.e "look at the holiness or unholiness of this or that priest/pope, etc."). Judas was an Apostle; but Judas was not holy.

"Now it came to pass in those days, that He went out to the mountain to pray, and continued all night in prayer to God. And when day broke, He summoned His disciples; and from these He chose twelve (whom He also named Apostles)." (Lk. 6:12-13).

God bless...

607 posted on 07/24/2007 4:52:59 PM PDT by fr maximilian mary ("Imitate Jesus, love Mary as your Mother." Mother Teresa of Calcutta)
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To: fr maximilian mary
Have to question your comment: Judas will not have one of the twelve seats seen in Revelations because he was never an Apostle in heart by Spirit whereas Paul was/is and will be seated there. Mattathias will not be on one of the twelve and he was chosen by lots by the eleven to replace Judas.
608 posted on 07/24/2007 4:57:02 PM PDT by MHGinTN (You've had life support. Promote life support for those in the womb.)
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To: fr maximilian mary
But Jesus chose Judas who committed the worst of crimes, does that mean He acted against God's will and was without the authority of God? Following your logic that would be the conclusion.

Jesus did not put Judas in charge of molesting Children. He chose Judas BECAUSE he knew that Judas would betray him. Jesus needed a betrayer in order that the prophecies would be fulfilled. Jesus chose him for that purpose.

By your logic these child molester Priests were placed there because Jesus wanted those children raped and molested. I think the better deduction is that Jesus allowed these people to be placed there in order that he could show the world the vacuity of the Catholic Priesthood.

610 posted on 07/24/2007 5:01:07 PM PDT by P-Marlowe (LPFOKETT GAHCOEEP-w/o*)
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To: fr maximilian mary; P-Marlowe

“The arguments being presented for apostolic succession are objective and scriptural, not subjective”

No, it is a subjective interpretation of scripture; a reading back into the text a desired result in order to buttress a desired position. Nowhere in scripture is there a command or mandate for “apostolic succession”.


615 posted on 07/24/2007 5:15:27 PM PDT by blue-duncan
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