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To: Forest Keeper

The Reformers were heretics who set up their own religions. I cannot possibly blame them for the current state of the Church, no, of course not.

As a matter of fact, after Vatican II, many of the new Catholic reformers started the Protestantization of the Latin Church, much to the dismay of the East. That is our fault, and not the Reformers. I do blame the Reformers for (and it is entirely my responsibility that I was not clear enough) creating a mindset that one could set up one’s own religion for one’s own reasons and that it could be done fairly easily, especially as new ones kept getting created. It became easier and easier to do.

Look at the religions created over time.

Reformation: Lutherans, Anabaptists, Anglicans, Presbyterians. Fairly solid and somewhat reminiscent of what they copied.

Restoration: Stone-Campbell churches, Jehovah’s Witnesses, Latter Day Saints, Christian Science.

20th Century: Snake handlers, World Wide Church of God, United Unitarian Universalists, Branch Davidians, Jim Jones/ Jonestown; Urantians (who believe Jesus was an ET), various white supremacist “Christian” groups, Children of God (COG)/Family of Love/Heaven’s Magic, Order of the Solar Temple, and so on.

As we progress, the scope and imagination of the founders get progressively scary.

The difference, I suspect, in how their souls will be judged is the difference that God may attribute to either forming a new religion or committing evil in the one that He created. There may be no difference; there may be some. All that I can do is to concentrate on those who do evil within the confines of the Catholic faith and deal with them.


5,385 posted on 09/04/2007 8:14:42 AM PDT by MarkBsnr (V. Angelus Domini nuntiavit Mariae. R. Et concepit de Spiritu Sancto.)
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To: MarkBsnr
I do blame the Reformers for (and it is entirely my responsibility that I was not clear enough) creating a mindset that one could set up one’s own religion for one’s own reasons and that it could be done fairly easily, especially as new ones kept getting created. It became easier and easier to do.

Well, no Reformer would say that the first were setting up a new religion. That only comes from critics. So, Reformers are not responsible for that. No Reformer ever encouraged anyone to set up his own religion. We just encouraged everyone to come to Christianity. But from what you go on to say, we may be using the word "religion" differently. How would you distinguish "a faith" from "a religion"?

As for who is responsible for the Reformation, I suppose the Apostolics would blame the Reformers, and the Reformers would praise God.

5,544 posted on 09/06/2007 3:05:21 PM PDT by Forest Keeper (It is a joy to me to know that God had my number, before He created numbers.)
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