The only thing your quotes prove is that Apostle Paul said different things to different audiences. There is no doubt that he said you can be severed from Christ and fall from grace, as well as that you can be secure and never fall from grace.
[saying that Christ came to save the world and not just the 'elect'] It would necessarily mean that Christ FAILED to do the will of the Father
I guess that's the part of the Bible the Protestants have rejected, even through it clearly says Christ came to save the world, sinners (all of us, because all are sinners, even the "saved").
Irrelevant. The Bible never says it is our call to make as to who is of the elect
There are many on your side of the divide who claim they very much know who is elect. Dr. E. knows her children are because "God gave them to" her. In other words, God doesn't give reprobate children to elect parents! You are the only one so far who claims not to know who is elect and who is not. I guess that's because you are a newbie Calvinist.
therefore no Biblical argument about the slavery you are talking about can be made
Your history is flawed, dear FK. The west justified slavery precisely through the Bible. various racist doctrines were formed in the west based on the Bible. the whole concept of predestined "elect" and predestined refuse is contrary to the idea of all humans deserving the same dignity, but rather divides people into the select and the rejected, even saying of the reject that God is not their Father (He is not, but by their decision, not His, and yes, when it comes to evil, man thwarts God's will, FK!).
Your own explanation PROVES that it cannot be true
FK verse 10 says the world did not recognize Him. Who were those who later recognized Him? Verse 11 says those who were His own did not receive Him? Who then received Him? All the people of the world are referred to as "His own." But we are not His simply because He created us. We can only be His is we come to Him after he calls us, and if we stay with Him. It is not that God is not the Father of the world, but that the world doesn't in its entirety recognize Him as their Father, rejects Him.
He did, the Jews first, and the gentiles also.. Rejecting Christ and the one he left in charge of this planet(Holy Spirit) is the problem.. Rejecting How?.. Rejecting by following men, dogma, and councils of men(clergy).. which is of course SIN.. HIJACKing the Holy Spirits authority.. Which is the ultimate Sin..
WHo then is/are proper "church" human "officials"?..
Those appointed and anointed by the Holy Spirit...
We all were WARNED to be careful of these guys..
To watch them and guard against the hirelings(John ch 10)..
Not ONLY Protestant, RCC and EO posuers.. but other pretenders..
Those NOT appointed and anointed by the Holy Spirit..
How can we tell which is which?..
If you are not careful and watchful, YOU CAN'T..
And can be easily deluded, it takes discernment..
In which case(if fooled) you will then be used like a rented donkey..
Could be thats according to plan..
***You are the only one so far who claims not to know who is elect and who is not. ***
Wrong, I have stated it many times. No one knows whom God has chosen, that is why we must tell the gospel to all we meet.
No, Paul was consistent. Yours is a forced interpretation of Gal. 5:4 in which the text follows from the conclusion. All of Paul's writings on the subject point to a sure salvation.
I guess that's the part of the Bible the Protestants have rejected, even through it clearly says Christ came to save the world, sinners (all of us, because all are sinners, even the "saved").
You say this, but you do not address the issue. If the Father's will was that all be saved, then you must believe that Christ failed to do the Father's will. Does Christ at least get an 'A' for effort? :) You have said before that for humans, we might be OK if we honestly try, but honestly fail. Is it the same with Christ?
There are many on your side of the divide who claim they very much know who is elect. Dr. E. knows her children are because "God gave them to" her. In other words, God doesn't give reprobate children to elect parents! You are the only one so far who claims not to know who is elect and who is not. I guess that's because you are a newbie Calvinist.
:) I have never heard Dr. E. say she knows who, by name, is of the elect. I've never heard any other Calvinist say it either (other than him/herself). I did see her speak earlier of Covenant baptism, but this does not determine who is of the elect. She knows that some who have this baptism as an infant will not ultimately be saved, and thus of the elect. In her 5304, Dr. E. cites the Westminster Confession. In that it says (emphasis added):
V. Although it is a great sin to contemn or neglect this ordinance,[13] yet grace and salvation are not so inseparably annexed unto it, as that no person can be regenerated, or saved, without it:[14] or, that all that are baptized are undoubtedly regenerated.[15]
VI. The efficacy of Baptism is not tied to that moment of time wherein it is administered;[16] yet, notwithstanding, by the right use of this ordinance, the grace promised is not only offered, but really exhibited, and conferred, by the Holy Ghost, to such (whether of age or infants) as that grace belongs unto, according to the counsel of God's own will, in His appointed time.[17]
God's counsel determines everything. This does NOT say that every "splashee" is saved. :) As for Dr. E. knowing about her own children, she is a mother, and well, mothers just know things. I mean, you're a man who's been around the block. Don't go there. :)
FK: "... therefore no Biblical argument about the slavery you are talking about can be made."
Your history is flawed, dear FK. The west justified slavery precisely through the Bible.
I obviously meant LEGITIMATELY Biblically made. I was talking truth, not history. I have no doubt that some used the Bible to justify all sorts of abominable acts throughout history. It didn't make them right. I showed that the Bible does not match their interpretations, and that no one can legitimately use the Bible to justify the type of slavery we are talking about.
The whole concept of predestined "elect" and predestined refuse is contrary to the idea of all humans deserving the same dignity, but rather divides people into the select and the rejected, even saying of the reject that God is not their Father (He is not, but by their decision, not His, and yes, when it comes to evil, man thwarts God's will, FK!).
Predestination does not divide anyone unless someone can name the elect. We Calvinists cannot, and no one can. Any of us will tell you that the elect are among all races, and any other demographic subdivision you can come up with. No one can point to any physical characteristic and claim "he is excluded" by legitimately reading the Bible. I'm sure there were false teachers on this on all sides way back when, but today nobody who is Christian teaches this. There is no discrimination since the Bible commands us to take the Gospel to ALL NATIONS.
[Re: John 1:10-12] FK verse 10 says the world did not recognize Him. Who were those who later recognized Him?
His children, the elect.
Verse 11 says those who were His own did not receive Him? Who then received Him? All the people of the world are referred to as "His own." But we are not His simply because He created us. We can only be His if we come to Him after he calls us, and if we stay with Him. It is not that God is not the Father of the world, but that the world doesn't in its entirety recognize Him as their Father, rejects Him.
"His own" can either refer to God's possessions or God's children, or both. If children, then they must have been purchased (1 Cor. 6:19). But if not children, then God still created them and God retains full ownership rights to do with them whatever He pleases. So, in verse 11, "His own" could mean all people (in which case the elect simply did not recognize Him YET), or those people who were not His children.
Verse 12 separates out His children one way or the other. No one accepts Christ until He calls him, as you said, and 12-13 are the key verses to prove that some people are God's children and some are not.