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MLG: I think where the easterns have difficulty here is the terminology of "place", which means a location in spacial dimensions, whereas they see the separation from God, ...... as one being of a purely spiritual condition, of "darkness" or the absence of Light. But in that construct, it is forgotten that the wicked will be resurrected to a real, physical body, which indeed does require a "place" since that body has spacial dimensions

FK: That's right. The scriptures are clear on that. To build in allegory without scriptural support for their own position is forced

The only thing the Scriptures is clear on is that the heaven is "up" there and hell is "down" somewhere in earth. Do you believe hell is in earth?

Christ has a Body sitting to the right "side" of the Father Who has NO BODY! Do you have any idea where Christ's body may be located in space?

Obviously, our language and conceptutal capacities are deficient in being able to express or know such mysteries intellectually, just as none of those alive really knows what it means to be dead. Only the dead do. A different dimension. They are profoundly experiential in nature, and as such can only be described allegorically and anecdotally.

Can you describe accurately what love is in real physical terms? Or can you only appeal to experiential and anecdotal tools and know that they all fall short of what you really know?

You cannot speak of the other dimension in terms of this dimension. All we know is that everything that lives dies. What happens behind that door is not within us to know in this dimention (of our existence), or to describe except as allegory. Literalism is a sure way to miss the point.

But you are right: allegories are forced upon us to describe the indescribable.

MLG: I think where the easterns have difficulty here is the terminology of "place", which means a location in spacial dimensions, whereas they see the separation from God, ...... as one being of a purely spiritual condition, of "darkness" or the absence of Light. But in that construct, it is forgotten that the wicked will be resurrected to a real, physical body, which indeed does require a "place" since that body has spacial dimensions.
FK: That's right. The scriptures are clear on that. To build in allegory without scriptural support for their own position is forced.

The only thing the Scriptures is clear on is that the heaven is "up" there and hell is "down" somewhere in earth. Do you believe hell is in earth?

And where did you get that idea from. Certainly it was not the Scriptures, which you consider to be myths.

The only thing the Scriptures is clear on is that the heaven is "up" there and hell is "down" somewhere in earth. Do you believe hell is in earth?

I have no idea where hell is, I just know that it exists as a place. The "up" "down" contrast could very well have been for our benefit of understanding, since the real truth could be incomprehensible to us. One possibility would be that the spiritual realm is in a dimension we cannot now perceive. I have no problem with that idea.

And scriptures ARE clear that Heaven and hell are places, as opposed to theoretical concepts.

Christ has a Body sitting to the right "side" of the Father Who has NO BODY! Do you have any idea where Christ's body may be located in space?

As MLG was saying, if Christ has a body, then it takes up space and must exist "somewhere". I have no idea where Heaven is, any more than hell, but the same thinking as above applies.

Can you describe accurately what love is in real physical terms? Or can you only appeal to experiential and anecdotal tools and know that they all fall short of what you really know?

Well, this is a family forum so I probably shouldn't do that. :) But seriously, of course God's love for His children is beyond what we may be able to describe, however, we are given what we NEED to know about it in the scriptures.

You cannot speak of the other dimension in terms of this dimension. All we know is that everything that lives dies. What happens behind that door is not within us to know in this dimension (of our existence), or to describe except as allegory. Literalism is a sure way to miss the point.

But I think we have to assume that when we ARE given allegory in scripture, what we are given is at least close to the actual reality. Once we declare something as allegory, and then interpret it to mean the exact opposite of what the allegory says, then I think the point is literally missed. An example of this on your side is that God never kills.