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To: Forest Keeper; MarkBsnr; D-fendr; Kolokotronis; Alamo-Girl; Dr. Eckleburg; HarleyD; blue-duncan
It just has to be IN FRONT OF something. None of that applied on the mountain top. IOW, no one climbs a mountain top to prostrate himself before God, then gets up and leaves without praying

I didn't mean to suggest that he wasn't praying. Prayer and adoration go hand-in-hand. And prostrating yourself before God is good anywhere because God is everywhere! Elder Cleopa used to serve Divine Liturgy on a tree stump as his altar table! In fact, our Lord even tells us that public worship is not the way to go (such as school prayer, etc.), but rather in the dark corner of your home. So, a mountain is a perfect to prostrate oneself before God.

Well, yes there is singing such as

The signing is not a problem. We also sing. The Jews sing and this is where that comes from, and your verse reminds us of that. It's the pastors parading back and forth, acting out, gesturing, boasting, etc., that draws attention to them (vanity). Our Lord did none of that.

So, those who boast and act and speak loudly when they preach are doing a poor imitation of Christ, especially when late Pastor Scott's attractive wife-turned-pastor flips her hair constantly...there is very little resemblance between Christ and her even if what she is preaching may be right.

Did Christ joke when He preached? Well, I was watching this rather well known woman preacher this morning and she kept her audience in stitches. Poor imitation. That's all. It's show business and not a "church."

I understand that not all Protestant churches are like that and I have heard sermons that were very, very Orthodox in their content, and delivered in a dignified and humble manner. But, again, Protestantism takes the wide road to finding the narrow path. It's a hit-and-miss approach.

Your services SHOULD be focused on God and God only

I can tell you have never attended one. It's not priest "performing" or joking. It starts with "Blessed is the Kingdom of the Father, Son and the Holy Ghost" and ends with "blessed is our God." Ninety minutes to two hours, depending on the feast, of pure praising God and petitions to God and mentioning in reverence God's chosen saints.

10,127 posted on 10/30/2007 5:10:05 PM PDT by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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To: kosta50; MarkBsnr; D-fendr; Kolokotronis; Alamo-Girl; Dr. Eckleburg; HarleyD; blue-duncan; ...
I didn't mean to suggest that [Elijah] wasn't praying [on Mt. Carmel]. Prayer and adoration go hand-in-hand.

OK, good. I always thought we were splitting hairs on "what prayer is". :) Would you then agree that if a Christian bows his head and closes his eyes and begins with something like "Dear Heavenly Father" and ends with something like "In Jesus' name I pray, amen", that all the stuff in the middle can normally be composed of any mix of adoration, confession, AND supplication? If you say "yes", then I think this issue is solved. :)

The Jews sing and this is where that comes from, and your verse reminds us of that. It's the pastors parading back and forth, acting out, gesturing, boasting, etc., that draws attention to them (vanity). Our Lord did none of that.

Yes, I agree, and I stand against them also. Certain televangelistic money machines have given what I believe in a bad name and I very much regret it. However, remember that Jesus Himself approved, at least implicitly, of the fact that there are different preaching styles:

Matt 11:18-19 : 18 For John came neither eating nor drinking, and they say, 'He has a demon.' 19 The Son of Man came eating and drinking, and they say, 'Here is a glutton and a drunkard, a friend of tax collectors and "sinners." ' But wisdom is proved right by her actions."

John the Baptist and Jesus clearly had two different preaching styles, yet both were correct for their intended purposes. So, I don't think that a fire and brimstone sermon can be said to be bad by itself (and I know you didn't say that), since that is how John preached. I'm just saying there is more than one good way to preach.

Did Christ joke when He preached?

A good and very tough question. I think He did, but it is hard to prove. God invented humor and knew that it was an effective means of communicating a message. It still works today. So, I can't think of why He wouldn't have also used it. Now, the humor of their time may well have been very different from what we think is funny today. However, I can imagine this line being delivered in a humorous way, in order to make a point:

Luke 6:41-42 : 41 "Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? 42 How can you say to your brother, 'Brother, let me take the speck out of your eye,' when you yourself fail to see the plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye.

I mean, this COULD have been said with a laugh, yes? :) I really think so. Just imagine the possibility. It certainly would not have diminished the point. And, since Jesus was fully human, He could not have been a humorless being.

FK: "Your services SHOULD be focused on God and God only."

I can tell you have never attended one.

While you are right about that, let me say that I wasn't criticizing you, I was fully agreeing with you in support by echoing your own words back. :)

10,227 posted on 11/01/2007 3:55:45 AM PDT by Forest Keeper (It is a joy to me to know that God had my number, before He created numbers.)
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