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Locked on 05/04/2007 8:18:10 PM PDT by Religion Moderator, reason:
Childish behavior |
Posted on 04/24/2007 12:35:04 PM PDT by Rameumptom
Why don't you tell us "needlenose_neely" I heard this tale for years so why don't you show all of us?
Than why don’t you stop with the childish baiting!
I ask you is the Trinity Jesus the Same Jesus is the Bible?
needlenose_neely,
Do you know the context of these quotes? They are not as you assume. Brigham Young talking about the role of capital punishment in Government. He was also taking about a jury of your peers, and weighing evidence. He was talking about that a Murderer should be contrite and confess.
What is very interesting is that these critics ignore the thousands upon thousands quotes about the full and universal power of the Atonment of Jesus Christ which started in the Garden of Gesthamene and culminated on the Cross.
Check out this link if you want to know what we really believe. Referring to those quotes is like referring to Dan Brown to understand Catholicism.
http://www.fairlds.org/Mormonism_201/m20110.html
I am so sick of these amatuers who claim to have any understanding on this topic.
Is this a typo or was it intentional?
I don’t know any Mormon who believes this nonsense about Mary as you selectively quoted.
Do you know what the process of creating Canon in the church is? We meet in our General Conference and we have a vote on what is accepted as scripture or not. If you want to illustrate what Mormons believe and you want to be truthful, then refer to those items which have been voted on and accepted as Canon. If you do that then you may be able reach us Mormons with reason. Otherwise, your attacks are transparent and hallow.
Where is that name coming from?
It might be instructive if you were to differentiate the preaching/teaching of Young as different from his prophetship.
Sure, that would be. It is also, I think interesting to note that we believe that doctrine needs to be accepted and supported by all the Apostles to be in effect. This is a scripture of the necessity of unamity of the concil of the Apostles.
But hey, if someone wants to tar my faith then they can just conveniently forgot those things.
>>At least Clinton’s choice of underwear was not religiously based, and I will say no more<<
I expect no criticism whatsoever from you of a girl with a blouse neckline down to her bellybutton and her g-string showing on her low-ride jeans. Or a gay male with a bare midriff. But perhaps criticism of a Jew for sporting a yarmulke. That might be okay by that logic.
Who is "crucifying" anyone? That's rather hyper-emotional hyperbolic rhetoric don't you think?
Is there anything wrong with an open discussion of what a religion purports to be the truth by way of critical analysis in the free marketplace of ideas?
It’s kind of like crucifying today’s Catholics for the wrongs of ancient apostate Popes.
Who is doing that?
But, on the other hand, would it be reasonable to question Nazi's based on what Hitler believed and set in place?
Then why do Mormon presidents and prophets still teach it?
The gay male and the girl with the G-string aren’t running for president.
And I would vote for a yarmulke-wearing Jew for president in a heartbeat, if his name were Joe Lieberman.
Nice try.
It’s not currently taught by the Church. I personally visited Mark E. Peterson in 1982 in the old Church Office Building to get his view on the subject (of what has come to be called the “Adam-God” theory). He told me unequivacally that the Church does not teach that and that it was Brigham Young’s musings. Make of it what you will, but I do feel like I got it from the “horse’s mouth” and that it represented current teaching.
I do not think its the underwear, I think its the issue of garments under the underwear.
Heres how Reagan viewed Mormons.
“Ronald Reagan truly admired the Latter-day Saints. His administration included more members of the Church than any other American president, ever. Three of us, David Fischer, Gregory Newell and I, served on his personal White House staff. Richard Wirthlin was his chief strategist. Ted Bell served as Secretary of Education, Angela Buchanan was Treasurer, Rex Lee was Solicitor General. His White House included Roger Porter, Brent Scowcroft, Richard Beal, Blake Parish, Jon Huntsman Jr., Dodie Borup and Rocky Kuonen, and there were many other Latter-day Saints throughout his Administration. President Thomas S. Monson served on a Presidential Commission on Volunteerism. Others were ambassadors. LDS senators and representatives were held in special regard, and the Tabernacle Choir was his special inaugural guest.” -Stephen M. Studdert, Special Assistant to President Reagan"
I also like Ann Coulters quote about Utah (though I am not a Utah-an).
"And also, the one thing that I have a very soft spot for is that I love Mormons. And the reason why I love Mormons, well, among other things, is -- you may have forgotten this -- Bill Clinton in Utah in 1992 came in third in Utah. Now, that's a fine state."
As for the religious debate, this thread was at 1,988 posts last I looked for anyone wanting to see some doctrinal debates.
Strange how Mormons are so intolerant of the slightest bit of critical analysis of Mormonism
Sorta like scientology.
I agree there is only One, True Jesus. However, Jesus Himself said there would be others to come claiming to be Him but are deceivers.
Paul also said there were and would be those who preached "another Jesus";
2 Corinthians 11:3-5 3 But I fear, lest somehow, as the serpent deceived Eve by his craftiness, so your minds may be corrupted from the simplicity[a] that is in Christ. 4 For if he who comes preaches another Jesus whom we have not preached, or if you receive a different spirit which you have not received, or a different gospel which you have not accepted—you may well put up with it!
Therefore, is the Jesus preached by the Mormon religion the same Jesus of the Bible?
Let's see what some of the presidents and prophets of the Mormon religion say about the matter.
The president and prophet of the Mormon church, Gordon B. Hinckley, made a very telling comment about Jesus Christ in a talk in Paris France on June 4, 1998. Hinckley said;
In bearing testimony of Jesus Christ, President Hinckley spoke of those outside the Church who say Latter-day Saints ‘do not believe in the traditional Christ. No, I don't. The traditional Christ of whom they speak is not the Christ of whom I speak. For the Christ of whom I speak has been revealed in this the Dispensation of the Fullness of Times. He together with His Father, appeared to the boy Joseph smith in the year 1820, and when Joseph left the grove that day, he knew more of the nature of God than all the learned ministers of the gospel of the ages.---Church News, week ending June 20, 1998, page 7
Note Pres. Hinckley's words, "The traditional Christ of whom they speak is not the Christ of whom I speak." Many who question Mormon teachings have been saying this for decades. The Christ of Mormonism is not the Christ of the Bible. Followiong are more specific reasons why the Jesus Christ of the Mormon church is not the one I believe in and cannot be found in the Bible.
According to Mormon presidents and prophets the spirit of Jesus did not always exist. It had a beginning.
The first thing to understand is that the "God the Father" of Mormonism has not always been God. He also had a beginning, just as his son.
President Joseph Fielding Smith said:
"Our Father in heaven according to the Prophet, had a Father, and since there has been a condition of this kind through all eternity, each Father had a Father"---Doctrines of Salvation 2:47
President Joseph F. Smith taught:
"I know that God is a being with body, parts and passions...Man was born of woman; Christ, the Savior, was born of woman; and God, the Father was born of woman"---Church News, 19 Sept, 1936, p.2
As shown in this chapter, our Father in heaven was once a man as we are now, capable of physical death...he and our mother in heaven were empowered to give birth to spirit children...(Achieving a Celestial Marriage, Copyright 1976, 1992 by Corporation of the President of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, page 132)
One Mormon has said that he doesn't know any Mormon who believes any of this today. However, check the dates of these teachings by the Presidents and prophets of the present Mormon church. They are not from the 19th century, they are recent and current. Therefore, one has to wonder how it could be said that no Mormons believe these things when they are being currently taught in Mormon literature, by current Mormon Presidents and prophets.
All men and women are...literally the sons and daughters of Deity...Man, as a spirit, was begotten and born of heavenly parents, and reared to maturity in the eternal mansions of the Father, prior to coming upon the earth in a temporal [physical] body'....very person who was ever born on earth was our spirit brother or sister in heaven. The first spirit born to our heavenly parents was Jesus Christ...Our spirits resemble our heavenly parents although they have resurrected bodies.---Gospel Principles, page 9, 1981 edition, page 11, 1997 edition
What this means is that while "God the Father" was progressing to become a God, the spirit of his son, "Jesus Christ," did not exist. Only after the "Father" became a god was he able to procreate the spirit of his son.
Is that the Jesus of the Bible? It's not the Jesus that I and Christianity knows of the Bible, that's for sure.
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