Posted on 01/05/2007 9:36:30 AM PST by Gamecock
Perhaps I'm misunderstanding.
Perhaps all these RW threads are meant as encouragements to him and support of him vs accusation. Maybe I didn't get the proper educational memo on the satire and I just misunderstand.
Is anyone smelling the blood of Quix and trying to go in for the kill? I hope not.
Well, of course they are Quix.
What other purpose driven ping could they possible serve?
Ah well, bless my soul.
I can just leave it all in peace and not bother my sweet bippy about it any further.
The other precious saints will keep the wolves at bay.
I don't need to. I understand what you obviously don't.
The Holy Spirit is the one that gives the ability to please God.
No kidding? Hello!! That's just what I said.
We are sinners. If my children emulate me, if yours emulate me, they are in trouble. Look to the cross, that is where salvation is, not in yourself.
If children emulate you they are in trouble. In your quest to attack Rick Warren about EVERYTHING, you have lost sight of the fact that God tells you to let Him do the Judging! IF your life is holy and pure before God, then, by all means, continue attacking Warren. IF not you better get the speck out of your eye and leave Warren to God, like HE says to do.
When you contacted Rick Warren to call him on the sin you see him doing in this latest article, what did he tell you?
I hope not. I'm in that boat with you. LOL
THANKS THANKS, BUDDY.
AT least God has our number quite well! I'm quite comfortable with HIS accounting! LUB, BLPH,
Is that what sent this traitor Warren to Syria?
You seem to have a problem distinguishing between your worksd and those enabled by the Holy Spirit.
That's exactly my point. I am a sinner. My children need a Savior. Not my feeble attempts to please God. My kids see a sinner. This sinner has introduced them their Savior. I teach them the Gospel, not moralism.
In your quest to attack Rick Warren about EVERYTHING, you have lost sight of the fact that God tells you to let Him do the Judging!
It is interesting that every post you have made to me had been judgemental. Speck/plank.
I've benefited from the reading of all four books of Maccabees, in this fourth and last of them especially, and especially this morning, in 4 Maccabees 6-14. In these testimonies I am reminded that the godly suffer various torments for godliness itself, for godliness makes us friends with God and enemies of this world and its ruler. That tyrant Satan hates us with great evil, and his world system is opposed to us, and our own flesh fights us in striving for holiness. 4 Maccabees shows us how our ancestors in this faith have won the battle for righteousness, how we may be overcomers by and through faith, believing in what is not seen by human eyes, and holding fast to the Promises of Almighty God Who Does Not Fail.
I've seen over and over again that though the books of the Maccabees are not included in the canon, much of what they teach and many specific expressions within those pages are quoted almost verbatim in the New Testament writings, especially by Paul, who was trained in these things under Gamaliel.
It seems good to me to post here a prophetic word from that Pharisee, who, speaking by the Holy Spirit as a leader among the Council shared a great wisdom:
“Men of Israel, take heed to yourselves what you intend to do regarding these men. For some time ago Theudas rose up, claiming to be somebody. A number of men, about four hundred, joined him. He was slain, and all who obeyed him were scattered and came to nothing. After this man, Judas of Galilee rose up in the days of the census, and drew away many people after him. He also perished, and all who obeyed him were dispersed. And now I say to you, keep away from these men and let them alone; for if this plan or this work is of men, it will come to nothing; but if it is of God, you cannot overthrow it—lest you even be found to fight against God.”
~Acts 5:35-39
Does not the Divine Commandment tell us
Have nothing to do with them.John the Beloved (2nd letter) has also a word for us on how to behave in righteousness concerning those whom we know to be liars:
Many deceivers, who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh, have gone out into the world. Any such person is the deceiver and the antichrist. Watch out that you do not lose what you have worked for, but that you may be rewarded fully. Anyone who runs ahead and does not continue in the teaching of Christ does not have God; whoever continues in the teaching has both the Father and the Son. If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not take him into your house or welcome him. Anyone who welcomes him shares in his wicked work.Am I saying that this man whose words and work are being spread so far and widely here and throughout the earth via the Web is such a one? I do not have to. It is obvious that others think that Rick Warren fits that bill. Whether he does or not is not what I am moved to address, but rather, that those who are of the One True Faith, to maintain their good confession, ought to show the fruit of the Holy Teacher. For Christ Himself lives in us, and if within, can we not maintain the good testimony of our works even as those who had this Righteous One only outside themselves, the Martyrs of Maccabees, in like manner prevailing and showing the conquest over sin and death?
This is how 4 Maccabees 6-14 fits in. It is the history of one true Eleazar and of seven brothers and their noble mother, keeping the commandment of God, the very Spirit of the Law, even under severe tortures. They did so by the encouragement of both the Scriptures and the courageous reminder-urgings to one another in the midst of the greatest trials. By watching one another endure in righteousness, despite trials and temptations, and in hearing one another speak the noble purpose, they were made into greater Overcomers. They urged one another on to good deeds and glorified God, amen.
Paul says, "I would build you up and not tear you down! I would be for your encouragement!" In another place we are exhorted to "encourage one another more and more as you see the Day approaching." Is the great and dreadful Day not closer now than it was then? Do we not partake of the Living Spirit and can we not by that Spirit obey the commands of our Faithful True God?
This I've learned: In the very moment that we look with judgment upon another, brother or enemy, we ourselves take part and become another root or branch of the very thing of which we are accusing the other! And we can not even see that this is what we become, because the very moment we become that, the root and branch fill our eye and we are blind in our own sin.
This I also know: Being encouraged ourselves by the Love and Grace of God in this precious tie that binds, HIS HOLY SPIRIT, and in encouraging the Brethren by our words and our witness, suffering under trial, we become root and branch of the True Vine that gives Abundant Life, and a clear eye with which to see. Let us take the log out of our eye then, and bear it as our Savior did, who went to his tree willingly, submissive to all the Will of the Father, and so become triumphant. He came not to judge, but to save. O let us walk His walk with great joy, for we know Who has gone before us!
Brothers, "Let us have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness, but rather expose them!" Do we expose them by partaking in them? A thousand times nay! We expose them by being Light-bearers. How are we bearing Light? By walking in His Word and Spirit, this is Christ, and so demonstrating that we are Children of Light and not of darkness.
We do not repay evil with evil, but we are the Overcomers who give goodness in return, and so put our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ on grand display!
Who is wise and understanding among you? Let him show by good conduct that his works are done in the meekness of wisdom. But if you have bitter envy and self-seeking in your hearts, do not boast and lie against the truth. This wisdom does not descend from above, but is earthly, sensual, demonic. For where envy and self-seeking exist, confusion and every evil thing are there. But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, willing to yield, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality and without hypocrisy. Now the fruit of righteousness is sown in peace by those who make peace.
~James 3:13-18O sacred and harmonious concord of the seven brothers on behalf of religion [Christ]!
~4 Maccabees 14:3
4 Maccabees 136: For just as towers jutting out over harbors hold back the threatening waves and make it calm for those who sail into the inner basin,
7: so the seven-towered right reason of the youths, by fortifying the harbor of religion, conquered the tempest of the emotions.
8: For they constituted a holy chorus of religion and encouraged one another, saying,
9: "Brothers, let us die like brothers for the sake of the law; let us imitate the three youths in Assyria who despised the same ordeal of the furnace.
10: Let us not be cowardly in the demonstration of our piety."
11: While one said, "Courage, brother," another said, "Bear up nobly,"
12: and another reminded them, "Remember whence you came, and the father by whose hand Isaac would have submitted to being slain for the sake of religion."
13: Each of them and all of them together looking at one another, cheerful and undaunted, said, "Let us with all our hearts consecrate ourselves to God, who gave us our lives, and let us use our bodies as a bulwark for the law.
14: Let us not fear him who thinks he is killing us,
15: for great is the struggle of the soul and the danger of eternal torment lying before those who transgress the commandment of God.
16: Therefore let us put on the full armor of self-control, which is divine reason [doxa].
17: For if we so die, Abraham and Isaac and Jacob will welcome us, and all the fathers will praise us."
18: Those who were left behind said to each of the brothers who were being dragged away, "Do not put us to shame, brother, or betray the brothers who have died before us."
19: You are not ignorant of the affection of brotherhood, which the divine and all-wise Providence has bequeathed through the fathers to their descendants and which was implanted in the mother's womb.
20: There each of the brothers dwelt the same length of time and was shaped during the same period of time; and growing from the same blood and through the same life, they were brought to the light of day.
21: When they were born after an equal time of gestation, they drank milk from the same fountains. For such embraces brotherly-loving souls are nourished;
22: and they grow stronger from this common nurture and daily companionship, and from both general education and our discipline in the law of God.
23: Therefore, when sympathy and brotherly affection had been so established, the brothers were the more sympathetic to one another.
24: Since they had been educated by the same law and trained in the same virtues and brought up in right living, they loved one another all the more.
25: A common zeal for nobility expanded their goodwill and harmony toward one another,
26: because, with the aid of their religion, they rendered their brotherly love more fervent.
Thanks Dear Heart. INDEED, INDEED, INDEED!
I shall endeavor more earnestly to apply myself toward the mark of the high calling as you have so beautifuly exhorted us to do.
Thanks.
Indeed.
Massively beautiful, touching, fitting and sobering.
LUB
Galatians 5
13You, my brothers, were called to be free. But do not use your freedom to indulge the sinful nature; rather, serve one another in love. 14The entire law is summed up in a single command: "Love your neighbor as yourself." 15If you keep on biting and devouring each other, watch out or you will be destroyed by each other.
16So I say, live by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the sinful nature. 17For the sinful nature desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the sinful nature. They are in conflict with each other, so that you do not do what you want. 18But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under law.
19The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.
22But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. 24Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the sinful nature with its passions and desires. 25Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. 26Let us not become conceited, provoking and envying each other.
Have often . . . and, .30Carbine's precious posts just above notwithstanding . . . still . . .
struggle with discerning Holy Spirit's application in my life . . .
of the contrast of Christ's behavior, tone, statements, spirit, attitude toward
1) the masses
2) the hurting
3) the religious rulers
They were all Christ--authentic, potent, anointed, fitting, piercing in various ways.
Some were piercing with compassion, empathy, Love personified; Father-Love tangibly body-slamming with the fierce forcefulness of GOD PRESENT in the situation in power, might and liquid eternal Resurrection Love.
Other moments, words, actions were piercing with forceful TRUTH ruthlessly, brazenly searing to the bone marrow with the smell of burnt marrow.
Both, actually, were LOVE. Truth in Love.
Many of the pharisees had evidently no chance given their willful blindness and stubborn idolatry of their own constructions on spiritual reality--no chance for eternal life because they persistently determined to maintain their death grip on their own constructions on reality.
But IF they were to have a chance . . . it had to be along the lines of accepting the body slams of truth that Jesus hurled at them with fierce forcefulness.
It was clearly not going to be along the lines of gentle discourse.
Therefore what, I don't know. Has been a persistent conundrum, challenge to me for most of my near 60 years.
I just know that both are God and both are Love. And I know that they are two sides of the same coin. And, IF I am not as willing to be used of Holy Spirit in one way as the other . . . I may miss what HE WISHES TO DO in a given situation.
St Paul demonstrated the same TRUTH IN LOVE LOVE OF JESUS though, of course, with his personality. There is the fierceness of the heavy sacrificial love of I Cor 13. Then there's the fierceness of him telling various congregations how to handle serious errors, attitudes, spirits, junk.
Therefore what, hereon, I don't know. Has been a troubling ponder every month I've been on FR for many years--since near the beginning minus absenses.
Thankfully, JimRob has given guidelines which SHOULD provide abundant clear guidance, boundaries, motivation to demonstrate Christ to a hurting world and diverse brothers and sisters way above average.
Yet, the result, day in and day out is a religion forum more fiercely hostile to God--His ways and priorities--as well as to man and particularly other believers--than about any on the net. This OUGHT NOT TO BE.
Mercifully, God has answered a lot of prayers and granted us an RM who has incredible wisdom, fairness, balance, discernment, True Spiritual maturity, tirelessness, . . . who labors uncommonly in the love and anointing of God. And it has made a tremendous difference for the better.
Nevertheless, the horrors continue. Always "for righteousness," "for the Gospel," etc. Gag me with a Scriptural filthy rag of our own works of righteousness.
I have no brilliant and certainly no startlingly anointed solutions.
.30Carbine has given us a marevelous, anointed new/old challenge which could help. Wish I weren't so skeptical.
The only thing I know that seems to have a chance is prayer and God intervening in the lives of sufficient individuals toward His passion for His priorities such that we see a change hereon.
I THINK THAT'S WELL WORTH A LOT OF PRAYER FOR.
I have been praying for God to impart to all fittingly needing a greater such imparting . . . God's search light's vivid illustration, demonstration, vision of folks own hearts as well as Rick Warren, Joel Osteen's etc. hearts.
When God does that sufficiently, there is NO REBUTTLE. None. Absolutely none. All the stones fall to the ground and all the religious rulers walk away from the prostitute realizing that they are as bad or worse. ALL.
INDEED.
Much indeed.
Though I personally would greatly appreciate your response to the issue of the other side of the Godly coin touched on in my post just above.
Jesus says, (Luke 7:35, Young's Literal)
'...and the wisdom was justified from all her children.'or the NIV
"But wisdom is proved right by all her children." .
Here is something we also need to consider:
Titus 3
3Remind them to be subject to rulers and authorities, to be obedient, to be ready for every good work, 2to speak evil of no one, to avoid quarrelling, to be gentle, and to show every courtesy to everyone. 3For we ourselves were once foolish, disobedient, led astray, slaves to various passions and pleasures, passing our days in malice and envy, despicable, hating one another. 4But when the goodness and loving-kindness of God our Saviour appeared, 5he saved us, not because of any works of righteousness that we had done, but according to his mercy, through the water* of rebirth and renewal by the Holy Spirit. 6This Spirit he poured out on us richly through Jesus Christ our Saviour, 7so that, having been justified by his grace, we might become heirs according to the hope of eternal life. 8The saying is sure. I desire that you insist on these things, so that those who have come to believe in God may be careful to devote themselves to good works; these things are excellent and profitable to everyone. 9But avoid stupid controversies, genealogies, dissensions, and quarrels about the law, for they are unprofitable and worthless. 10After a first and second admonition, have nothing more to do with anyone who causes divisions, 11since you know that such a person is perverted and sinful, being self-condemned.
12 When I send Artemas to you, or Tychicus, do your best to come to me at Nicopolis, for I have decided to spend the winter there. 13Make every effort to send Zenas the lawyer and Apollos on their way, and see that they lack nothing. 14And let people learn to devote themselves to good works in order to meet urgent needs, so that they may not be unproductive.
15 All who are with me send greetings to you. Greet those who love us in the faith.
Grace be with all of you.*
Thank you very much.
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