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To: Forest Keeper; Kolokotronis; Gamecock; The_Reader_David; xzins; Quix
What ecatly is your assessment of the Jerusalem Council?

My assessment is that it convened over a disagreement among people who were supposed to be inspired, which troubles me. In particular, the dispute arouse between +James and +Paul. One can argue that Halakah was not firmly established yet. Regardless, whether it was or not, Christians in Israel considered themselves Jewish, worshiped in accordance with Judaism, followed Judaic customs and habits.

I just think it's curious that +Peter's 'vision' (under 'trans') is described in Acts 11, and the Jerusalem Council in Acts 15. Coincidence, or neatly packaged sequence of events? I don't know. It is +Paul who speaks of rebuking +Peter for 'living like a Gentile," yet expecting Gentiles to live like the Jews. So, the dispute +Paul had was with more than just +James, although one has to dig a little to find this.

It was +Paul who (together with +Barnabas, and apparently Titus, an uncicumsised Greek), but under +Paul's initiative, who argued that circumcision, "Jewish baptism," can be dispensed with! This is equivalent to someone telling you that one doe snot have to be baptized to become a Christian. I don't know about Protestants, but the Orthodox Church would not consider those people Christian even if their theology was identical to the EO theology (save for Baptism). So, in effect, +Paul was arguing to introduce something that was fundamentally against the Jewish Law.

[NB: the book of Acts shows significant difference depending on which version of the Bible is used; the 5th century Alexandrian version is the one used primarily in the West; the Eastern version is reflected in the 4th century AD Codex Sinaticus. The accounts surrounding the Council of Jerusalem are not identical in those versions]

After +Peter spoke (in words that sound very Pauline to me), +James basically invoked the laws of Noah. But the earliest account of the so-called Council in Jerusalem comes from +Paul. It states that he came to Jerusalem to "lay before them the gospel (he) proclaimed among the Gentiles" (Gal 2:2)! He also claims that this was a "private meeting," and not a Council. According to +Paul's own writing, the three 'pillars' of the Church, +Peter, +John and +James, agreed with him and offered him "fellowship," and and sent him to preach to the uncircumcised, asking him only to remember the "poor of Jerusalem."

So, to answer your question, I think there are a lot of different angles and versions to this, compounded by different copies purporting to be the 'originals.' These e accounts speak of different times, persons, size of the meeting, people ("pharisees who believed"), conclusions, etc. All this somehow seems a little made up to me. The book of Acts, which was written after +Paul's death, differs from +Paul's version in Galatians, and exists in western and eastern versions, both of which differ significantly.

But one thing is clear: the purpose of the account in the so-called 'Council' of Jerusalem was to provide scriptural 'justification' initiated by +Paul to dispense with God's Laws given to Moses so as "not to burden" the Gentiles when Christ never explicitly or implicitly gave such permission or even mentioned such a possibility. Then comes +Peter's 'vision' in a 'trance' a few chapters earlier, just in time for the Council in Acts 15, and a very seemingly choreographed account of that meeting.

7,921 posted on 01/29/2007 7:08:55 AM PST by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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To: kosta50; Kolokotronis; Gamecock; The_Reader_David; xzins; Quix; Blogger; Dr. Eckleburg; HarleyD
[On the Jerusalem Council:] It was +Paul who (together with +Barnabas, and apparently Titus, an uncircumcised Greek), but under +Paul's initiative, who argued that circumcision, "Jewish baptism," can be dispensed with! This is equivalent to someone telling you that one does not have to be baptized to become a Christian. I don't know about Protestants, but the Orthodox Church would not consider those people Christian even if their theology was identical to the EO theology (save for Baptism). So, in effect, +Paul was arguing to introduce something that was fundamentally against the Jewish Law.

Even as a Southern Baptist I know that baptism is not required to be Christian. Of course, God commands it, and so all Christians should be baptized, but it is not salvific. Paul appears to recognize this, but as before, Paul is still very pro-baptism. Paul is correcting all those who believe that ritual is required to enter Heaven.

But one thing is clear: the purpose of the account in the so-called 'Council' of Jerusalem was to provide scriptural 'justification' initiated by +Paul to dispense with God's Laws given to Moses so as "not to burden" the Gentiles when Christ never explicitly or implicitly gave such permission or even mentioned such a possibility.

Christ said He came to fulfill the Law, and He gave His revelation to Paul personally. Paul speaks of the fulfillment that Christ promised.

8,488 posted on 02/01/2007 2:17:48 PM PST by Forest Keeper
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