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To be God, Christ's eternal pre-existence must be preserved. That Mary carried God in her womb I don't believe would be contested here. But Jesus brought his deity with him. It didn't have its origin, source, or anything else in Mary. He was HER God too. He was her Creator.

Mary as Mother of God is imprecise. It is fraught with difficulty (even though I know what the council was getting at and agree with their premise- I disagree with their title for the above mentioned reasons).

Which all begs the question, WHY does the Catholic church venerate, pray to and for all appearances worship the woman, Mary.

And why do men fall to their knees to a likeness of her when Scripture specifically forbids this?

I think an excellent answer lies in Michael Carroll's book, "The Cult of the Virgin Mary: Psychological Origins."

Kornthal Church

"Valley of Grain"

Let's preserve and maintain what our forefathers have left us.

The church was built by Protestant families of the Lutheran faith who immigrated from Austria to this country in the year 1852 - 1853. Landing at New Orleans these immigrants came up the Mississippi by flatboat to a spot called Willard's Landing near the present town of Ware. Traveling a few miles eastward they settled in a fertile valley which they called Kornthal, meaning "valley of grain". The community was never incorporated s a village, but at one time consisted of a church, a church school and parsonage a box factory, a grist mill, a county store and a distillery. However the present parsonage is not the original one.

The planning of the church was begun soon after settlement was made and typical Austrian Bestial (house of prayer) design was used. Austria was then under Catholic domination and Protestant churches were not allowed to have spires, nor were they permitted to have doors opening on the street. It was a plain frame oblong structure with side doors and no steeple, 30 x 50 feet in size. The Front entrance, the steeple and bell tower were added in 1889.

The interior of the church is impressive because of its unique designing and the fine quality of its workmanship. The pews were hand made of native yellow poplar, complete with kneeling racks. Balconies were constructed the full length of the building on both sides. The high pulpit placed the minister on the level of the balconies.

*And the protestants went to their services with their Bibles - and they also had Bibles in the pews for those who forgot them - and they knelt and worshipped their Bibles, right?

Rushing in where angels fear to tread:
Which all begs the question, WHY does the Catholic church venerate, pray to and for all appearances worship the woman, Mary.

And why do men fall to their knees to a likeness of her when Scripture specifically forbids this?

As to "venerate": I can only talk about my own experience. Some 20 years before I became Catholic it occurred to me one day that Mary had said "Yes," to God's call, delivered by the angel. And that saying such a total "yes," was answered with her having a major role in bringing Love itself into the world. And I realized, I wanted to do that. At that point Mary became one of my heroes, ahead, even, of Chuck Norris.

As to "pray to": I ask people to pray for me, and I pray for others, sometimes at their request and sometimes not. Good people who strike me as about as holy as a human can be this side of death ask for Mary's intercession. I am impressed by their example. I continue to follow the example because the practice seems favorably associated with ineffable rewards.

As to "appearances": People often see what they want to see and stop looking too quickly. People often prefer leaping to a conclusion which confirms their prejudices to moving slowly and cautiously toward the truth.

As to: "And why do men fall to their knees to a likeness of her when Scripture specifically forbids this?": We do it to scandalize Protestants.

Okay, seriously, I can't speak for the intentions of everyone, but I personally do not bow down to idols or images. I may bow down before them but my heart is making reverence or prostration not to something I imagine is in the image. There was, I believe, an ecumenical council about this.

Now I have a question: Why do SOME Protestants insist that Catholics believe and do what we do neither believe nor do and then change the subject or avoid the issue when we present evidence of the truth in answer to their statements? Is there a book of Psychology about that?

Or, put it another way: Why do the nations so furiously rage together, and why do the people imagine a vain thing? When it comes to saying that Catholics do the very thing they repeatedly deny and explain deny or believe what they repeatedly say they don't believe -- well things don't get much more "vain" than that. It suggests that maybe, just maybe, some people have taken counsel together against the Lord and against His Anointed.

Oh wait. We don't read the Bible either.