Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

To: annalex; Blogger; Dr. Eckleburg; bornacatholic; P-Marlowe
"you got a lot of scripture to spin away from."

In all of these passages of scripture you cite, the people that Paul, Jesus and His brother James are talking or writing to are believers and the message is the same, "become and live out what you are already".

To the believers at Philippi, Paul says the sanctifying process is work Phil. 3:14-15, "I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus." that is what he is saying in 2:12, not that somehow they will lose their salvation. Context, context, context.

Phil. 2:12, "Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

In Matthew 5-7, Jesus is talking to His disciples. He has already told them a couple of times that "the Kingdom of Heaven is at hand". Now He is telling them what is their inheritance in the Kingdom and the rewards that await them. There are unbelievers in the multitudes that are auditors who will learn what the blessings of the Kingdom are, but this is not a prescription for entrance into the blessing, but a description of the blessings of the believers now. Verses 5:3 and 5:10 say "for theirs is the Kingdom of Heaven". Is, is in the present indicative, a present possession. The two verses form a stylistic device called an "inclusion". That means that everything bracketed between 5:3 and 5:10 is included under the one theme "for theirs is the kingdom of Heaven".

Matthew 5,
1 And seeing the multitudes, he went up into a mountain: and when he was set, his disciples came unto him:
2 And he opened his mouth, and taught them, saying,
declaring who are blessed
3 Blessed are the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
4 Blessed are they that mourn: for they shall be comforted.
5 Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.
6 Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled.
7 Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy.
8 Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.
9 Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God.
10 Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
11 Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.
12 Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great is your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you.

In the Matthew 25 passage Jesus is just explaining what a believer does naturally because of the change in his nature. He does not work for his salvation but there are natural fruit of his salvation, like readiness, fruitfulness, and love for one's neighbor. These don't earn salvation but naturally flow from it.

Matthew 25
31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:
32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:
33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.
34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:
35 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in:
36 Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me.
37 Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink?
38 When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee?
39 Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee?
40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.
41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:
42 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:
43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.
44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?
45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.
46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

In the Luke passage, the question of how one earns or inherits salvation is answered by Jesus with a simple "man can't". "Who then can be saved? And he said, The things which are impossible with men are possible with God." Salvation is all of God, by faith.

Luke 18:18f, And a certain ruler asked him, saying, Good Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?
19 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? none is good, save one, that is, God.
20 Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Honour thy father and thy mother.
21 And he said, All these have I kept from my youth up.
22 Now when Jesus heard these things, he said unto him, Yet lackest thou one thing: sell all that thou hast, and distribute unto the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, follow me.
23 And when he heard this, he was very sorrowful: for he was very rich.
24 And when Jesus saw that he was very sorrowful, he said, How hardly shall they that have riches enter into the kingdom of God!
25 For it is easier for a camel to go through a needle's eye, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.
26 And they that heard it said, Who then can be saved?
27 And he said, The things which are impossible with men are possible with God.
28 Then Peter said, Lo, we have left all, and followed thee.
29 And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or parents, or brethren, or wife, or children, for the kingdom of God's sake,
30 Who shall not receive manifold more in this present time, and in the world to come life everlasting.

James, writing to the early church made up of mostly Jewish believers, tells them the same thing that Paul and Jesus did. Salvation is by faith alone and the evidence of it is the new nature which has written upon it the two commandments which the believer naturally works out. "And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God."

The idea that a man is justified by his works is just another way of saying (Mat 7:20) "Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them."

James 2
14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?
15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,
16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?
17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?
21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
25 Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?
26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.
4,191 posted on 01/06/2007 6:23:30 PM PST by blue-duncan
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4154 | View Replies ]


To: blue-duncan; Blogger
In all of these passages of scripture you cite, the people that Paul, Jesus and His brother James are talking or writing to are believers and the message is the same, "become and live out what you are already".

AMEN! That's beautiful. "Become and live what you are already" in order to "prove" the will of God true.

"And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God." -- Romans 12:2

4,193 posted on 01/06/2007 6:31:17 PM PST by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4191 | View Replies ]

To: blue-duncan; Blogger; Dr. Eckleburg; bornacatholic; P-Marlowe
In all of these passages of scripture you cite, the people that Paul, Jesus and His brother James are talking or writing to are believers

To a believer, works are salvific and he is judged by them. To a non-believer, it is not clear, but he is still called to good works because there is a "law written in his heart". Exactly what the Church teaches.

In Matthew 25 the general judgement of everyone is described. Faith is not directly mentioned. Likewise in the last chapter of Apocalypse.

Generally, what Christ taught is addressed to all. With the trick of noticing who Christ is addressing and then saying "That does not apply to me" anything can be dismissed. You found a way to selectively negate any of the scripture.

I can tell you where the audience is important: when an action is described. When Christ heals a paralytic, He heals that man only. Likewise, when He breathed the Holy Ghost, He breathed It to the Apostles only -- your earlier mistake from the Erasmus thread.

Now, earlier did you indeed maintain that the Beatitudes are solely for the Apostles' consumption, or did you misspeak? Because if you dismiss the Beatitudes, it is hard to take any of your theological opinions seriously.

4,410 posted on 01/08/2007 7:56:23 AM PST by annalex
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4191 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson